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Do humans have inherent value?
#21
RE: Do humans have inherent value?
I think any value we assign humans is from a social and intrinsic nature we give each other.

I'm currently reading a book on philosophical ethics, and in the book a lot of the discussion is around the various forms of ethics (normative, practical & metaethical) of the values we "discover" and apply to humans. Currently I'm of the opinion we have no intrinsic value, but that it instead is inter-dependent, IOW all values on and about human beings is (artificially) applied on human beings and their endeavors.
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself — and you are the easiest person to fool." - Richard P. Feynman
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#22
RE: Do humans have inherent value?
(June 12, 2021 at 10:36 pm)Macoleco Wrote: And if yes, can their actions nullify that value?

I want to read your opinions.

This can never be an either/or proposition. 

In the context of 13.8 billion years, knowing that the planet has had 5 major mass extinction events, and also knowing that billions of years from now, it is most likely our species will also go extinct prior to the sun expanding and killing all life, no we are not important.

But in the short term, while our species is alive, we most certainly are important to our own survival.
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#23
RE: Do humans have inherent value?
(June 12, 2021 at 10:36 pm)Macoleco Wrote: And if yes, can their actions nullify that value?

I want to read your opinions.

I think that people have many inherent values, though I don't know that any of them are the kinds of values that would satisfy people, and it probably doesn't take any action on our part to nullify a number of them.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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#24
RE: Do humans have inherent value?
Yes.
The market value is somewhere between the ball of lint I had when I was 3, and 1/16 thimble full of pyrite dust.
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#25
RE: Do humans have inherent value?
(June 13, 2021 at 1:06 am)LadyForCamus Wrote:
(June 13, 2021 at 12:54 am)Macoleco Wrote: Explain please

We value each other and ourselves, generally. But value is a judgement. I don’t think we have any sort of objective, intrinsic value.

Pretty much this. My wife is the gardener in our household, and so values manure much more than I do. This applies to human beings as well - some people are completely shitty.

Boru
‘Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.’ Ralph Waldo Emerson
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#26
RE: Do humans have inherent value?
Some?

Aren't we just Mr. fucking optimism.
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#27
RE: Do humans have inherent value?
(June 13, 2021 at 1:29 pm)no one Wrote: Some?

Aren't we just Mr. fucking optimism.

Yes. Yes we are.

Boru
‘Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.’ Ralph Waldo Emerson
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#28
RE: Do humans have inherent value?
(June 13, 2021 at 1:06 am)LadyForCamus Wrote:
(June 13, 2021 at 12:54 am)Macoleco Wrote: Explain please

We value each other and ourselves, generally. But value is a judgement. I don’t think we have any sort of objective, intrinsic value.

I don't completely disagree, but talking of inherent value in this way robs the phrase of any meaning. I don't think people are mouthing empty phrases, so in some sense "inherent value" must refer to something other than literal, objective, intrinsic value. I've been trying to think about what that is the past day, but haven't really arrived at anything. Do you think when people use the term inherent value they are just talking nonsense?
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#29
RE: Do humans have inherent value?
(June 13, 2021 at 2:49 pm)Angrboda Wrote:
(June 13, 2021 at 1:06 am)LadyForCamus Wrote: We value each other and ourselves, generally. But value is a judgement. I don’t think we have any sort of objective, intrinsic value.

I don't completely disagree, but talking of inherent value in this way robs the phrase of any meaning.  I don't think people are mouthing empty phrases, so in some sense "inherent value" must refer to something other than literal, objective, intrinsic value.  I've been trying to think about what that is the past day, but haven't really arrived at anything.  Do you think when people use the term inherent value they are just talking nonsense?

I think that people should choose their words more carefully lest others think they are spouting nonsense.
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#30
RE: Do humans have inherent value?
What I am trying to say is that society in general assigns value to humans just for being humans. Which is why humans right exist. And even if for the nazis the Jews had no value, the whole world disagreed with them.

Now, if everyone has an intrinsic value, can it be nullified? In the tríala of Nuremberg it seems that was the case, as they executed multiple nazi officials.

Then, am I in my right to believe that some people have no value due to their actions?
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