Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: December 21, 2024, 9:15 am

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Mass shooting in the middle school Vladislav Ribnikar in Belgrade
RE: Mass shooting in the middle school Vladislav Ribnikar in Belgrade
Property is theft. War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.
[Image: extraordinarywoo-sig.jpg]
Reply
RE: Mass shooting in the middle school Vladislav Ribnikar in Belgrade
Quote:I don't understand why the burden of proof would be on the pro-gun side. They are not the ones advocating the use of force. It's the anti-gun people who are advocating the use of force (to forcibly take guns away from people), so obviously they have to at least prove it will result in the desired outcomes (less violent crime).

And even if the burden of proof is initially on the pro-gun side, doesn't the Gary Kleck study (concluding that guns save 10x more lives as they take) switch that burden of proof? Like the fact that we see the Moon switches the burden of proof onto the Mad Revisionists (the conspiracy theorists who claim the Moon doesn't exist).
Glecks study is crap and your perspective is delusional.
"Change was inevitable"


Nemo sicut deus debet esse!

[Image: Canada_Flag.jpg?v=1646203843]



 “No matter what men think, abortion is a fact of life. Women have always had them; they always have and they always will. Are they going to have good ones or bad ones? Will the good ones be reserved for the rich, while the poor women go to quacks?”
–SHIRLEY CHISHOLM


      
Reply
RE: Mass shooting in the middle school Vladislav Ribnikar in Belgrade
(May 16, 2023 at 11:07 am)FlatAssembler Wrote:
(May 15, 2023 at 11:04 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: Imagine that.  A world in which almost everybody who pulls a gun on someone else wasn't actually in any danger of losing their life.  Like the thief who robs people at gunpoint.  I wonder if he thinks he needs to protect himself from his clients, too?

Bank robberies and store robberies do not happen hundreds of thousands times per year, though.

Well, I guess we'll have to remove those types of crimes from the explanation for hundreds of thousands of defensive uses, won't we?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Reply
RE: Mass shooting in the middle school Vladislav Ribnikar in Belgrade
(May 16, 2023 at 11:11 am)FlatAssembler Wrote:
(May 16, 2023 at 12:34 am)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: Because you STILL can't be sure that the attacker would have killed the respondent if the latter hadn't had a gun. Also, whether one is being 'attacked' is a very subjective matter. In recent news, people have been shot for ringing the wrong doorbell, approach the wrong car, or pulling into the wrong driveway. In each case, I'm sure the shooter felt they were in imminent danger of being harmed or killed, but the circumstances of those cases argue against it.

Boru

Do you have any evidence that happens hundreds of thousands times per year?

What’s that got to do with anything? Those were only used as examples to show that Kleck cannot determine after the fact if any particular life was saved by the use of a gun. In other words, it’s all but impossible to know if an assailant would have killed the person responding to Kleck’s question if the respondent hadn’t brandished a firearm. All he’s shown is that people predisposed to point a gun at someone believed that they were in immanent danger of being killed (colour me shocked) - this is why people who routinely carry firearms do so, because they think the world is teeming with people who want to kill them.

Boru
‘I can’t be having with this.’ - Esmeralda Weatherwax
Reply
RE: Mass shooting in the middle school Vladislav Ribnikar in Belgrade
(May 16, 2023 at 2:46 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote:
(May 16, 2023 at 11:11 am)FlatAssembler Wrote: Do you have any evidence that happens hundreds of thousands times per year?

What’s that got to do with anything? Those were only used as examples to show that Kleck cannot determine after the fact if any particular life was saved by the use of a gun. In other words, it’s all but impossible to know if an assailant would have killed the person responding to Kleck’s question if the respondent hadn’t brandished a firearm. All he’s shown is that people predisposed to point a gun at someone believed that they were in immanent danger of being killed (colour me shocked) - this is why people who routinely carry firearms do so, because they think the world is teeming with people who want to kill them.

Boru

But don't you think it is kind of arrogant to think that almost everybody who thinks a gun saved his life is mistaken? I mean, don't they know better than you, since they have actually been in that situation?
Reply
RE: Mass shooting in the middle school Vladislav Ribnikar in Belgrade
(May 12, 2023 at 5:45 pm)arewethereyet Wrote: He just has different flavors of nonsense.

Kinda like Baskin & Robbins, but with more flavors.
Thief and assassin for hire. Member in good standing of the Rogues Guild.
Reply
RE: Mass shooting in the middle school Vladislav Ribnikar in Belgrade
(May 19, 2023 at 12:13 am)FlatAssembler Wrote:
(May 16, 2023 at 2:46 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: What’s that got to do with anything? Those were only used as examples to show that Kleck cannot determine after the fact if any particular life was saved by the use of a gun. In other words, it’s all but impossible to know if an assailant would have killed the person responding to Kleck’s question if the respondent hadn’t brandished a firearm. All he’s shown is that people predisposed to point a gun at someone believed that they were in immanent danger of being killed (colour me shocked) - this is why people who routinely carry firearms do so, because they think the world is teeming with people who want to kill them.

Boru

But don't you think it is kind of arrogant to think that almost everybody who thinks a gun saved his life is mistaken? I mean, don't they know better than you, since they have actually been in that situation?

It isn't a case of them being mistaken, it's a case of skewing the sample.. Look at Kleck's sample (not the sample size, but who he questioned): he drastically over-represented not just men, but the oldest male in each household with a gun. These are people predisposed to think they need firearms to preserve their lives, so naturally they're more likely to think that whenever they waved a gun in someone's face, their life was in danger.

No, they don't know better than me - they can't possibly. The only way to know for certain sure that they would have lost their life if they didn't use a gun would be to see into the future. No matter how much they believed they were about to be killed by an assailant (or a dog or the clerk who short changed them), there's simply no way for them - or Kleck or you or me - to know.

Boru
‘I can’t be having with this.’ - Esmeralda Weatherwax
Reply
RE: Mass shooting in the middle school Vladislav Ribnikar in Belgrade
BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote:Look at Kleck's sample (not the sample size, but who he questioned): he drastically over-represented not just men, but the oldest male in each household with a gun.
You can argue that leads to a 30% overestimate, but you can not claim that leads to a 90% overestimate (which would be necessary for guns to kill more people than they save).
Reply
RE: Mass shooting in the middle school Vladislav Ribnikar in Belgrade
Why 30%, you reckon?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Reply
RE: Mass shooting in the middle school Vladislav Ribnikar in Belgrade
(May 19, 2023 at 9:17 am)The Grand Nudger Wrote: Why 30%, you reckon?

It was the first thing he could reach when he dug in his ass for something to pull out.
[Image: extraordinarywoo-sig.jpg]
Reply



Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Alec Baldwin Shooting onlinebiker 252 20611 August 17, 2022 at 9:28 am
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Grand Rapids Mi Shooting onlinebiker 111 10023 May 11, 2022 at 10:13 am
Last Post: Angrboda
  Colorado shooting, 5 dead. brewer 0 383 December 28, 2021 at 8:11 pm
Last Post: brewer
  Oakland School Shooting onlinebiker 99 9248 December 7, 2021 at 8:21 am
Last Post: arewethereyet
Thumbs Up President Biden orders mass deportation of immigrants onlinebiker 135 9007 September 22, 2021 at 8:49 pm
Last Post: Angrboda
  Official Mass Shooter Thread Brian37 351 25153 June 13, 2021 at 2:14 pm
Last Post: BrianSoddingBoru4
  Columbus Police Shooting onlinebiker 43 4293 April 25, 2021 at 9:08 pm
Last Post: Ravenshire
  Your Villain Is Served - Middle Aged White Man Duty 15 1742 December 27, 2020 at 11:06 pm
Last Post: The Architect Of Fate
  Protests in Belgrade FlatAssembler 3 483 July 16, 2020 at 12:18 pm
Last Post: Porcupine
  The Lady Doth Protest Too Much, Methinks - Hysterical White Middle Class BLM Activism Duty 31 2911 July 1, 2020 at 5:44 am
Last Post: Pat Mustard



Users browsing this thread: 2 Guest(s)