Evidence for Jesus Christ?

[Darwinian]

Maybe this should be started as a new thread, but I think that something miraculous should remain under the evidence for Jesus theme. I had a little vine plant that I set into a glass jar with only water in it for the plant to grow. It didn't take long before the vines began to run down the sides of that jar. It seems like nothing special had happened here, but I began to ponder, Where did the plant get all of that material from which to build itself? The water is just hydrogen and oxygen mixed togeather. That would account for the water in the stems and leaves, but where did all of the solids come from. I dont think that the light coming from the lamp offered any solids, maybe just energy for the plant to do the synthesis of plant product. So where does the material actually come from? Is that plant sucking in dust and making plant stuff with it. I didn't even notice that plants had the ability as dust suckers to begin with. They do breathe through small holes on the undersides of their leaves, but I had no idea that I had thismuch dust in my house. This little plant was gaining volume way faster than the dust entering the room. What else is in light other than various forms of radiation? That little seedling is gaining ground in my room. Someone must be putting somthing in the water.

Most of the 'mass' that goes into your little plant is carbon, which of course it gets from the atmosphere in the form of CO2 and water, which, hopefully, you provide.

Beautiful yes. A stunning example of one of the many incredible mechanisms that evolution has led to, yes. Miracle, um, let's see if you can work that one out for yourself.

[Minimalist]

His miracle threshold seems shockingly low!

[Napoléon]

I am not expecting anyone to believe blindly. The evidences which you seek can be had by asking. The personal helps that God can show you is how to understand yourself. Many people are unaware what drives them to do what they do. Some search for money or power. Some want to be the most intelligent, , some the most strong or attractive or most accomplished at some job. We all want recognition or respect and we do all manner of things to obtain them. When God visits He will help you to understand why you are the way that you are. He will give you endurance and help with the trials of life. Those personal insights are the core of faith in someone you don't see, but with whom you can definitely feel. The difficult thing for believers to do is explain these monumental personal changes that come with faith(trust). Most people will try to identify their personal miracles with the brand of faith that they choose. Each person with a religion will try to associate their experiences with those of which they are familiar and with what is most common to them. My original reasons that I did not want any part of God were the very same issues that many of you have here. If God loves us, why doesn't He take care of business down here? Why is Bible interpretation so scrambled and confusing. If I had not encountered God by the challenge to Him that I did, I imagine that I might still be atheist too. Since my experiences were good news to me, I have wanted to share them, even if they seem stupid or unreasonable. If I am wrong in my assertions here, you will gain nothing. But if I am right, you can have another dimension open up to you that will expand your understanding of things. All you have to do is ask. You will be surprised if you really need to know!

RDK, if it was as simple as asking, the whole world would be fucking christian. I'll shout up to god right now, "HEY GOD! YOU THERE?..."


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*looks at watch*

I'm still waiting...

Oh but I guess I have to 'open my mind!' or 'be willing to accept him!' or some other such bullshit along those lines? If that's the case then it goes in direct contradiction of your very first sentence: "I am not expecting anyone to believe blindly".

[Anomalocaris]

Come on Chuck, just answer the questions. I am not affected by your childish insults. If I didn't have something important to share, I would not be here.

You don't have anything important to share. It only seems important to you because you are ignorant about basic science, impressionable where "Christ", and probably a whole lot of other things, is concerned, and have a disgraceful tendency to jump directly to the gullible, shabby and superstitious explanations you feel comfortable with thanks to your suggestibility even when just a tiny amount of effort on your part would allow you to uncover the fact that the state of human knowledge have passed your miracles by many centuries ago.

If you think I am insulting you, it's because I am doing the best I can to humor you without completely giving you up as never being capable of anything more than the suggestible fool that you are now.

As to material for your vine, much of your vine is indeed carbon pulled straight out of the air, but much of the trace nutrients essential for biological function is present in tap water or delivered to the water by dust in the air.

Provided you had junior high education, you should know you can validate this by an experiment. If Jesus is providing the substance, the the plant should grow if you were to indeed remove all possible substance from the water and air, right? So put your vine in a bottle of distiller water that is truly purified of dissolved nutrients, put the whole thing in an artificial nitrogen oxygen atmosphere without any CO2 so the plant can't pull carbon out of the air, and enclose the whole thing so there is no airborn nutrient dust particles drifting into the water. Let's see if someone really put substance into the plant where there is no appropriate substance in the plant's environment.

While you are looking at how no one, miraculous or earthly, is giving the plant substance to grow that the plant can't acquire through natural biological process, you might also ponder another question. let's say someone did hypothetically do what you can see with your eyes is not actually being done. How the hell would you know it is Jesus? Why not Buddha, or a time traveling mortal from AD 2635 armed with cloaking technology? All the evidence you have for Jesus, even if the impossible were to menifestly happen, is still just your mental fart.

[RDK]

I wasn't looking for a rehash of junior high biology. This question about the source for plant production was intended to make you think about the mechanism involved into the formation of plant product. Carbon left all by itself does not create anything. There is definitely a process, that once started, fuels life. The oddity here is not that it does it. We can all observe the mechanism working. Its the working part which is the miracle. The carbon is the fuel for the device, but without the device there is nothing to make the carbon change into anything else. The strangest part of this is that the device has to be fully functional before it can process carbon in the first place. So there must have been some prior mechanism to start this whole process going. That's where the evolution/creation debate begins. The difficulty about evolution is that it requires fully functional mechanisms to adapt themselves to new environments without direction.

[Minimalist]

I wasn't looking for a rehash of junior high biology.

Which you probably flunked.

[RDK]

Min, do you always take everything that people say as offensive? You thrash around like your the final authority and answer for everything. I know that there are happy atheists out there, your just not one of them.

[Minimalist]

No, only self-righteous xtian assholes.

Look in the nearest mirror to find one.

[Anomalocaris]

I wasn't looking for a rehash of junior high biology. This question about the source for plant production was intended to make you think about the mechanism involved into the formation of plant product. Carbon left all by itself does not create anything. There is definitely a process, that once started, fuels life. The oddity here is not that it does it. We can all observe the mechanism working. Its the working part which is the miracle. The carbon is the fuel for the device, but without the device there is nothing to make the carbon change into anything else. The strangest part of this is that the device has to be fully functional before it can process carbon in the first place. So there must have been some prior mechanism to start this whole process going. That's where the evolution/creation debate begins. The difficulty about evolution is that it requires fully functional mechanisms to adapt themselves to new environments without direction.

Rehash of junior high schoold biology is the only avenune open to you that would give you opportunity to be less of a idiot then you are now. To actually be a lesser idiot you will need to also abandon your god and follow modern biology until you've e demonstrated a good fundamental grasp of the critical details.

Before that only thing you might make people think about is just how few working neurons it takes to string words together into semi-coherent sentences, and what a discredit it is to the concept of christ it is - if more discredited it can indeed be - to be championed by ignorant morons who rehash the same old creationist bullshit in its name, such as you.

[downbeatplumb]

I wasn't looking for a rehash of junior high biology. This question about the source for plant production was intended to make you think about the mechanism involved into the formation of plant product. Carbon left all by itself does not create anything. There is definitely a process, that once started, fuels life. The oddity here is not that it does it. We can all observe the mechanism working. Its the working part which is the miracle. The carbon is the fuel for the device, but without the device there is nothing to make the carbon change into anything else. The strangest part of this is that the device has to be fully functional before it can process carbon in the first place. So there must have been some prior mechanism to start this whole process going. That's where the evolution/creation debate begins. The difficulty about evolution is that it requires fully functional mechanisms to adapt themselves to new environments without direction.

You are commenting on something you seem to know next to nothing about.
You say the trouble with evolution is.... then spout crap that was explained away with evidence and scientific reasoning decades ago.
Please learn evolutionary biology to a at least junior school level before atempting to use it to shoehorn in your magic man.