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September 28, 2011 at 2:58 pm (This post was last modified: September 28, 2011 at 2:58 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
I'm fairly confident that you are relieved of any obligation to present evidence for Exodus on this forum, as it's becoming painfully obvious that you will simply quote scripture. Most of us own or have access to a bible and are familiar with the story. We don't need you to be an arbitrator between god and ourselves, nor do we require that you read scripture to us, we can all read, obviously.
Jesus fucking christ.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
(September 28, 2011 at 2:33 pm)Welsh cake Wrote: No. Jonah getting swallowed by a whale and surviving for three days inside it is more 'probable', and I use the term very very generously because its biologically impossible for most whales' anatomy to accomplish said feat, like Blue Whales for example, and Sperm Whales' lack of air cavities mean even if it happen you'd die of decompression sickness and/or asphyxiation within minutes.
Asphyxiation/drowning, yes. Decompression sickness, no - unless there was air available to breathe.
(September 28, 2011 at 2:58 pm)Rhythm Wrote: nor do we require that you read scripture to us, we can all read, obviously.
I reckon that's just a very poor and cheap attempt to convince us some how. You know, convince us to ignore facts.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence - Carl Sagan
Mankind's intelligence walks hand in hand with it's stupidity.
Being an atheist says nothing about your overall intelligence, it just means you don't believe in god. Atheists can be as bright as any scientist and as stupid as any creationist.
You never really know just how stupid someone is, until you've argued with them.
September 28, 2011 at 3:31 pm (This post was last modified: September 28, 2011 at 3:55 pm by Simon Moon.)
There is evidence of regional floods. They happen all over the world.
A flood as described in the Bible did not, or could not have happened.
There are cultures all over the world that existed before the Biblical flood was supposed to have occurred and continued to survive during and after the Biblical flood supposedly occurred. Their history is continuous without any interruptions. If a global flood occurred, then why the cultures with continuous, uninterrupted histories?
There is no evidence in any field in science that a flood as described in the Bible could have, or did occur.
You'd believe if you just opened your heart" is a terrible argument for religion. It's basically saying, "If you bias yourself enough, you can convince yourself that this is true." If religion were true, people wouldn't need faith to believe it -- it would be supported by good evidence.
(September 28, 2011 at 2:32 pm)Rhythm Wrote: In other words, you found evidence that floods occur, which is of course not in dispute. Evidence for the biblical flood, global, the giant boat, the rest of the fairy tale?
Also, why, and please tell me you actually thought about this, do you think that a supernatural explanation for a flood deserves consideration when the causes of floods are understood in great detail and do not require divine intervention?
I sent you a great link detailing evidence based objections to a global flood, the entire narrative in fact. You didn't address any of them. You've simply responded here with "I believe.". I have to say that this is the most disappointing thing I've yet experienced on this forum. I think you should have taken more time on this. Perhaps you'd like to take another crack at it? What you've presented here is not an educated response, nor is it anything even approaching what I would consider the kind of research that any adult should be capable of. Why did you even research the subject if you were going to defer instead, completely, to the narrative in dispute?
To summarize......WTF Salty?
Wow...Rythm. This couldn't be the most disappointing thing you have experienced, there have been plenty of people before me that don't meet your standards.
Let's clear some things up: I thought you were giving me that link to look over what people were concerned about, but I thought I established in our second run with this that I would answer the question with some archeology. The question was "Did the flood occur?" I answered the general question, are you trying to tell me that I need to focus my research on the 11 topics that were presented from the link?
I believe you're well aware that I am not scientifically minded, that I am not going to use my personal time and life energy to look at wind patterns and the probability of the water vaporizing concerning the flood, there are apologetic websites about these subjects! You can read up on all of that for yourself!
I thought the main reason for me to answer the question was so that you could see me evaluate evidence (or lack of it) and learn my opinion on what I've read. I thought it was so that you could see me think for myself and yes, I still trust God, and yes I am still expressing my thoughts the way that I do it. I didn't think that you actually wanted me to present a CASE, I'm not Lee Strobel!
Concerning my research. I am addressing creationism, evolution, the trinity and theories on the age of the world, but I don't have the time on my hands to write a book on any of these subjects! I barely have time to get on this forum anymore. Really, I don't know what you do in your spare time, but I have a life, I have a husband, I have a job, I have a family, I have a church, I have responsibilities, therefore the research that I "fit in" for you (and El Dinero), no matter how upsetting (or disappointing), shows my devotion to speaking for myself, thinking for myself to answering people I have no obligation to answer. You didn't specifically ask me a question that you were not sure of, that you were debating, you and El Dinero presented the fact that I expressed an interest to learn and you were checking to see if I would follow through with my interest. This is what I'm doing!
Whatever the case, just know that I have other things going on and I "make time" for you and everyone here because I care. And... you know what...I really don't need to take an earful from you, like this...
I have to get off. I have to get back to my job. Sorry I can't read everyone's responses, but I'll be back to answer.
Salty
"And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him." Hebrews 11:6
September 28, 2011 at 3:39 pm (This post was last modified: September 28, 2011 at 3:44 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
You're the one that claimed that there was evidence for a flood. Should I link you to the posts? What's disappointing isn't that you didn't find any evidence, I knew before you began that you wouldn't. Whats disappointing is that you are unable to admit this, and instead make the statement that evidence for the flood narrative somehow depends on faith. It does not. Forgive me for calling bullshit when you claim to be thinking for yourself while quoting scripture.
So tell me, Salty, what have you learned? Don't even start in on some persecution bullshit. Who told you that you weren't beholden to us for any of this? Who told you to take your time? If you didn't want an earful, you shouldn't have posted that garbage.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
(September 28, 2011 at 2:23 pm)salty Wrote: I bought an old book called The Bible As History by Werner Keller (New York, 1981).
I'd say that was a waste of money...
There is so much invalidating evidence for the ark story that I can't fathom how any reasonably intelligent adult could posibly believe it. For starters, how did certain species of animals end up on far-flung parts of the planet if the only living creatures emerged from a boat stranded on a mountain in Turkey roughly 4,000 years ago? How could kangaroos and koala bears have possibly made it to Australia? How did tortoises get to the Galapagos Islands? How did snakes get to South America? They swam the Pacific Ocean? And how could a handful of people construct a keel for a 450' long boat? The story makes no sense as literal history.
Science flies us to the moon and stars. Religion flies us into buildings.
God allowed 200,000 people to die in an earthquake. So what makes you think he cares about YOUR problems?
Salty is mad. She believes in fake shit, just like they all do. The best thing to do is ridicule their intelligence. World flood... ok tell me then where did all the extra water come from to encompass the whole earth, you can't make something out of nothing.
Its not real.
The bible is not written by any god, just men.
It is all stories and bullshit. And you actually believe it hahahahaha.I laugh at you, I feel sorry for you.
I have debated pastors and others like that, they can not and will not ever convince me of anything, because they lack things called FACTS. Just like you have none.
The basic premise can never be proven or validated.
The holy bible is fiction, plain and simple.
"supernatural considerations as to its origin" That is such a stupid thing to say. For real? Floods happen all the time, are they supernatural NO. Is anything proven to be supernatural NO. So how can you explain things as being supernatural, that is taking the lazy approach. MAGIC did it!!!! Such an anti-intellectual. hahaha. But you religious people give me tons of laughter...
Supernatural means defying physics. If that happened well the world would collapse as we know it, if I could all of a sudden magically go through walls, all laws that govern the universe would be in total chaos. You people don't think at all. Its sick.
Fact: Women lie.
My mother is a woman, therefore she’s a liar.
Uhhhhhh thats a fallacy, which is incorrect logic.
"...the illegality of cannabis is outrageous, an impediment to full utilization of a drug which helps produce the serenity and insight, sensitivity and fellowship so desperately needed in this increasingly mad and dangerous world."
- Carl Sagan
Species repopulated areas in such a convenient manner for evolutionary biologists, didn't they...lol.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
