Just saw this video today and don't know what to think. I have a handful of dear Muslim friends, and even though I don't get into much conversation with them regarding their beliefs, I can't imagine them agreeing with this. Especially the part about death for sins/stoning for adultery being the proper punishment that should be implemented world wide. I want to show this to one of them and to ask them about it... ask them if they agree. And if they don't agree, ask them why all these people are saying this is normal. But I'm not going to because I don't want to upset them or cause any problems. Is anyone able to shed some light on this? Perhaps it's fake? Perhaps it's just that specific country that is very radical?? Ugh. This is very discouraging for us who always advocate "not all Muslims."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bV710c1dgpU&app=desktop

Then Islam needs a serious amount of reformation, just as Christianity did.

I know a couple of Muslims who consider themselves "cultural Muslims", as in they drink and act like the rest of us and go to mosque maybe once or twice a year.

(November 18, 2015 at 4:56 pm)Beccs Wrote: Then Islam needs a serious amount of reformation, just as Christianity did.

I know a couple of Muslims who consider themselves "cultural Muslims", as in they drink and act like the rest of us and go to mosque maybe once or twice a year.

One thing that I find "disturbing" is how religious young Muslims still are when compared to young cultural Christians - Younger generations are becoming less and less religious, I can't seem to find any friend who even goes to church regularly, but that is not the case with Muslims - I wonder if it has to do with immigration, or with some of them having proper Islamic schools even in countries like England? I also wonder how we, as a society, are supposed to react to a religious demographic when we are becoming less and less religious. Let's not be overly nice, more and more people are starting to see God claims as the tremendous BS it is, and that's good, but I dunno how we will be dealing with a group of people who have serious potential to become the world's religious majority in a few decades. Dunno as well how it will impact social issues like gay marriage and women's rights.

CL, that video is an argument against ANY religion with barbaric precepts - including your own.

Most modern Christians (including Catholics) don't champion stoning disobedient teens to death, stoning witches to death or stoning those who worship other gods to death. Anotherwords, the less they are true to their religion, the better. What does that tell you about their (your) religion?

(November 18, 2015 at 5:14 pm)Dystopia Wrote: Younger generations are becoming less and less religious, I can't seem to find any friend who even goes to church regularly, but that is not the case with Muslims - I wonder if it has to do with immigration, or with some of them having proper Islamic schools even in countries like England?

From an English point of view, it appears to me to be down to their sense of identity. I get the real vibe that a lot of young muslims identify as "muslim first". By that I mean, they consider themselves muslim before they consider themselves English. Might seem a strange thing to say seen as one is a religion and the other a nationality (the stupidity of it is not lost on me), but the reality is that a lot of muslims in my experience have this kind of mindset. Or at the very least seem to.

Whenever I see groups of young muslim lads they seem very close knit. Even when they don't seem to know each other they still shake hands when greeting. I've seen shitloads of young muslims acting all pally with each other and saying "what up cuz?" and all this other shite. The one guy I went to uni with would speak to me every day, I'd greet him EVERY DAY. I thought we got on quite well. But he never ever shook my hand when we met, he never ever showed the same enthusiasm when he saw me. But he saw another random muslim guy in the hallway that he only knew by acquaintance and acted as though they were best buds.

People who don't often see this kind of thing will probably think it pointless nonsense that doesn't mean anything. But to me it's blatantly obvious that shit goes on behind closed doors and muslim families IMHO absolutely must be propounding and reinforcing a sentiment of "us and them", especially with the younger generations.

(November 18, 2015 at 5:18 pm)AFTT47 Wrote: CL, that video is an argument against ANY religion with barbaric precepts - including your own.

Most modern Christians (including Catholics) don't champion stoning disobedient teens to death, stoning witches to death or stoning those who worship other gods to death. Anotherwords, the less they are true to their religion, the better. What does that tell you about their (your) religion?

...It tells me we learned from our awful mistakes as times change, culture changes, and people evolve and become more educated. 

You seem to be saying only Catholics who are not true to Catholicism are against stoning. That is not the case because the death penalty is against Catholic teaching, and the past several popes have spoken out against is vehemently. If a Catholic is for stoning adulterers or even for the death penalty in criminal cases, that person is going against official Church teaching, not staying true to it.

Islam is divided between two main sects :
1-Sunna
2-Shiia

The speakers/audience are Sunna.  For example, you'll see Muslims who are neither shia nor sunna, who don't support these views.Like me.
Though both sects (Sunna/shia) agree on stoning.

For starters, stoning is not present in the Quran. Sunna / shia used something called "Hadith" to fetch that sentence; i.e it's not a part of the original faith. I never agreed on stoning. 
Sunna Muslims do the disaster, then say "all Muslims do it". They should speak about themselves only.

(November 18, 2015 at 5:29 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote:

(November 18, 2015 at 5:18 pm)AFTT47 Wrote: CL, that video is an argument against ANY religion with barbaric precepts - including your own.

Most modern Christians (including Catholics) don't champion stoning disobedient teens to death, stoning witches to death or stoning those who worship other gods to death. Anotherwords, the less they are true to their religion, the better. What does that tell you about their (your) religion?

...It tells me we learned from our awful mistakes as times change, culture changes, and people evolve and become more educated. 

Well yeah, exactly. But dogmatic religion isn't like that. If a religion is dogmatic, it is right or it is wrong. There is no room for change. If you are open to change, you must admit the foundation of your religion is not infallible. If that's the case, why the dogma? Why not embrace something more flexible like Secular Humanism which acknowledges the changing, advancing state of knowledge and enlightenment?

(November 18, 2015 at 5:34 pm)AtlasS33 Wrote: Islam is divided between two main sects :
1-Sunna
2-Shiia

The speakers/audience are Sunna.  For example, you'll see Muslims who are neither shia nor sunna, who don't support these views.Like me.
Though both sects (Sunna/shia) agree on stoning.

For starters, stoning is not present in the Quran. Sunna / shia used something called "Hadith" to fetch that sentence; i.e it's not a part of the original faith. I never agreed on stoning. 
Sunna Muslims do the disaster, then say "all Muslims do it". They should speak about themselves only.

Thank you for shedding some light. Would you say the people in this video are pretty extreme? Or are they an accurate representation of the average Muslim?

(November 18, 2015 at 5:43 pm)AFTT47 Wrote:

(November 18, 2015 at 5:29 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: ...It tells me we learned from our awful mistakes as times change, culture changes, and people evolve and become more educated. 

Well yeah, exactly. But dogmatic religion isn't like that. If a religion is dogmatic, it is right or it is wrong. There is no room for change. If you are open to change, you must admit the foundation of your religion is not infallible. If that's the case, why the dogma? Why not embrace something more flexible like Secular Humanism which acknowledges the changing, advancing state of knowledge and enlightenment?

That is very true about dogmatic teachings not changing. 

"Death Penalty = moral" was never a dogmatic Catholic teaching, but a practice of the time... though an awful and embarrassing one. But you are correct. Church dogmas don't change, and neither will they ever. A couple examples of these are the belief that Jesus is God, and the belief that Mary got pregnant with Jesus through the Holy Spirit. We believe them to be absolute truths, and truths don't change.