OK...

Well, you can't just say secularism is also [lots of other things]. Specific groups of people can be those other things. But complaining "about secularists" is just inaccurate and pointless. You seem to see some connected agenda, and that may be true regarding some people. But certainly not all, any more than I'd assume a particular Muslim is a machete wielding maniac.

Everyone can improve, sure. We should all work together. But the role secularism specifically has is to try and keep equality and fairness for all. It doesn't make sense to say that is the problem, when surely that is the goal you want too.

Anyhow. I really can't stop people in the East killing each other over different fairy tails. Nor can I tell my government how to act. All I can do is promote equality, rational thought and peace, and hope some people somewhere follow my example. I vote for the party I think best represents what needs doing. I wish I could have a greater impact.

It seems as though you imagined that "atheist westerners", as a demographic, aren't loaded with people that loosely agree with you on -many- issues.

As others have pointed out to you, the beef you have isn't with "atheist westerners" or with secularism (the reality of either completely eludes you, and perhaps you prefer your fantasies in any case).....but so long as you and others like you can be made to chase your own tails with that bullshit, the demographics whom you might actually have a beef with will not be required to respond to your criticism, well built or not, because you have not addressed it to them.  Further, it turns you into a mass of rambling idiots - casually and routinely ignored by those ideologically opposed...while you alienate yourself from "atheist westerners" who -would be- your ideological allies in that regard....if only you'd stop with the idiotic rambling bit.

Consider -your- part, in the very situations that distress you.

Do you imagine, for a moment, that anything -can or will- be done about this situation without "western" help, or that you will find more ideologically compatible allies, to that end, in "theistic westerners".......with their shared jewpocalypse fantasy?

...and here I thought I didn't have innocent memories left from childhood to ruin......  

I went and used the wrong spelling again didn't I. Whoops! Like that time I wrote homophones. And the tenants of atheism. Haha!

I'll repeat, secularists.....the "atheist westerner" demographic and the "dis-sasatisfied with the state of isreal" demographic have broad overlap..which is a resource you squander by rambling like an idiot about "atheist westerners" and secularism...the office of the american presidency, and the annihilation of isreal in a single day sans western support.

Atlas, you have lost the plot. I won't be continuing the discussion.

(February 23, 2016 at 8:46 am)AtlasS33 Wrote: Constable Dorfl

And here is why I asked the question. A secular post WW2 UN, which neglected religion and claimed to be non-religious, was the first to allow religious fanatics to create a caliphate with a religious symbol in the middle of its flag.

No numbnuts it didn't. It was a combination of initial US and UK support followed up by continuing money and guns being funnelled in by countries such as Saudi Arabia and the UAE which created this accurate image of islam in our midst. You cannot blame the powerless for the monsters the powerful themselves created.

(February 23, 2016 at 4:25 pm)Constable Dorfl Wrote:

(February 23, 2016 at 8:46 am)AtlasS33 Wrote: Constable Dorfl

And here is why I asked the question. A secular post WW2 UN, which neglected religion and claimed to be non-religious, was the first to allow religious fanatics to create a caliphate with a religious symbol in the middle of its flag.

No numbnuts it didn't. It was a combination of initial US and UK support followed up by continuing money and guns being funnelled in by countries such as Saudi Arabia and the UAE which created this accurate image of islam in our midst. You cannot blame the powerless for the monsters the powerful themselves created.

Poor world !
Actually, the united states dominated us, even Israel itself. It's not like I know nothing of the U.S & UK contributions to the creation of the two cancers in the Middle East:

-Arab Countries
-The Jewish state

Believe me, I'm very aware of sykes-picot.
and for the record, in here, I cited the British/Arabic role in creating this mess,o check my wikipedia quotes two comments back.

I'm turning insane, because I never relate. I don't belong anywhere.
But the world could've done more, if secularism as some claimed, care about equality and human rights.

Today, Sweden was sucking up the Sauds and apologizing for the statements of the brave foreign minister against the terrible human rights violations, but hey, it's secularism xD criticize yesterday, make up and apologize tommorow, no big deal !