(May 12, 2016 at 2:09 pm)Losty Wrote:

(May 12, 2016 at 10:03 am)Drich Wrote: What would be a convincing reason?

I don't know...it's hard to say.

I suppose some sort of scientific evidence.

Also if all the people of the earth had believed all throughout history that, though it doesn't actually prove anything probably would have convinced me.

Well if you want to look at the world through the History of belief or 'religion.' then know a religion typically dies one or two generations after the support structure abandons it. For instance once egypt fell after the new kingdom with in 100 years all the visible tombs monuments dedicated to their system of belief were looted and defaced. Meaning once their gods/government who protected their gods died so too did belief in them. This phenomena happens repeatedly throughout history.

Now what's left are philosophy based beliefs that can only die if the philosophy dies, and religions that are still being supported by something or someone.

Despite what most of you think. People are not all stupid. Not to the tune of the billions who believe. there is a support structure to all systems of belief, that HAS to conform to the teachings of the religion. for philosphy based religions this support can be any philosophical principle that is widely accepted and this system will continue on fueling itself. However for deity based religions this 'religious fuel' is harder to manifest. Meaning it is far harder to keep people interested if your God is based on full filling certain things. Unless... That God distances himself from the people at mandates strict rules and swift punishment, then empowers believers to carry out said punishments. then so long as people wish to control others, this type of religion is fueled.

However, if a religion promises direct interaction with it's central deity without an intermediary then without support from said deity, this religion would fail quickly. especially when it tells us we will be made to endure hardship and trials.. There has to be something greater than just sheer hope for a religion like this to last a single generation much less thousands of years.

The point is/was made when I brought up doubting Thomas. Meaning God will do whatever needs to be done for us to establish and maintain our Belief. Yes He commends who can do everything on faith, but at the same time He was there for Thomas who couldn't just poop the faith he needed.

I am a doubting thomas, like I think most of you are. That is why i am here. I do not get faith or people who have an endless supply of it. I am more like the jews wandering in the desert who witnessed all kinds of miricles and yet find myself doubting something every other day. thankfully God is faithful so long as I remain faithful to what he has given me.

Quote:

Quote:You have a lot of nerve Dripshit. I mostly tolerate your bullshit, but you have crossed a line and that is unacceptable.

Then perhaps you shouldn't draw lines you don't want crossed.

That's exactly what lines are for, Drich - establishing boundaries.

(May 12, 2016 at 2:10 pm)Drich Wrote:

(May 12, 2016 at 2:00 pm)drfuzzy Wrote: Just how . . . ignorant ARE you, Dripshit?  Are you actually incapable of doing the basic research that would occur to any 12-year-old before screaming out your brainless lies?  Just a few easily-discovered actual facts about sacred texts:

*  The first Egyptian hieroglyphs regarding their gods dates back to approximately 3000 BC. 
*  Chinese oracle bone script that tells about gods and creation myths date to 1200 BC.
*  Around 700 BC, the poet Hesiod’s Theogony offered the first written cosmogony, or origin story, of Greek mythology.
*  The first Hindu texts date to 700 BC, and the Bhagavad Gita was composed 400 BC. (I'm surprised Little Rik didn't yammer at you about this one first.)
*  The Roman Gnaeus Naevius, during the 3rd century BC, composed an epic poem (about the first Punic War) that referenced his Roman Gods and thanked them for their aid.

Now before I kick you in your teeth with a obvious point your missed, and dismount you from your 'high horse' do you want to go back and reread what my argument actual says. Hint: I did NOT say Christianity is the oldest recorded religion.

How typical of a preacher to threaten violence.  No, you said that there were no "texts". (Literal quote: "surviving documents") There are a LOT of surviving documents that describe religions thousands of years earlier than xtianity.  Just because a hieroglyph isn't passed around today in book form as an Egyptian "bible" does not mean that it was not a "text", and it does not mean that the stories it contained were not "sacred" to the people who wrote them.

(May 12, 2016 at 2:22 pm)TheRocketSurgeon Wrote:

(May 12, 2016 at 2:03 pm)Drich Wrote: You do know what Non religious means right?

Yes. However, like most things, I have no idea what you mean when you  say it!

Are you seriously trying to suggest that teaching him how to reason, to use science, and not pressuring a child to adopt a religion before they're of an age to truly understand what they're doing, is indoctrination?

But to answer the question in the most generic form possible, I am against indoctrinating children with anything other than demonstrable facts, and for teaching them how to make up their own minds with critical thinking skills.

Seems to me you get it (now.)

To educate is indoctrination. or do you believe we teach our children to be critical of everything that we say or do?

We give them the illusion of critical thought but in certain instances draw lines in society that can not be questioned.

Things we deem 'rights' can not be questioned. Things we deem a 'moral absolute can not be questioned without questioning the person who is being critical core values.

But, for most of you this level of indoctrination is perfectly acceptable.

My question is, if you never critically look at the absolutes of soceity how then can you be sure they are indeed a 'good' thing?

You all seem more than willing to question anything different, just not yourselves. not what you hold sacred.

For me emjay, (I admit I didn't read the full thread), is that it always seemed like a story book. I mean, I tried to believe it was factual when I was a kid. The whole Noah's Ark thing blew it away for me. I just couldn't and still can't see that being true. So if bits and pieces were hard to get over, I couldn't take any of it seriously. I did try to though.

Dripshit you are the lowest form of low. You call yourself a christian, yet refuse to act according to what you believe. You are a cumstain on the pillowcase of life and nothing more than a bad choice your mama made when she spread her legs.

I think you secretly obsess about what sort of upset you're going to cause here when you get up in the morning. For that I find you abhorrent. Your posts here today towards me were nothing more than ignorant, rude and they intentionally hit below the belt. Shame on you. You are a morally reprehensible thing. I can't even call you a human because you fall far beneath humans on the food chain. You're more like a bottom feeder because you actively seek out and cause hurt whenever you can by feeding off of people's emotions. You are an infuriating little cunt of a man who has zero tact and zero empathy. You take people's vulnerabilities and exploit them to suit your own agenda. You don't just do it here. You do it all over this forum.

You disgust me. You disgust many on here. I'd liken you to a small child who doesn't grasp the concept of doing the right thing, but I can't because eventually even a child can learn what the right thing is. You however, disregard the feelings of others just to make a point about your stupid, narcissistic god. The two of you deserve each other. Neither of you are capable of "doing the right thing". Ever.

Now kindly go fuck yourself with a sharpened stick. The pointy end. Make sure you stick it so far up your ass that it pierces what little brain you have. Asshole.

(May 12, 2016 at 2:30 pm)Drich Wrote: My point exactly.

It is my ministry, but where you seem confused is I make no effort to convince anyone of anything. As per my very first post here. I am here to provide clarity about biblicaly based Christianity and answer questions concerning it.

You actually intend to run an unconvincing ministry?  Look, if you don;t want to discuss improvement that's fine, but the bullshit is getting thick.  

Quote:My involvement here in this thread was based in large part as a measure to provide a more accurate picture of who God is according to the bible. Most of what I answered to were 'disbelief' posts based on a corrupt version or an inaccurate idea of who or what God is.

A more accurate picture of god...but apparently, not a convincing picture or a picture in who's accuracy you can convince.  

Quote:That is the reason I answered those that I did, while refraining from other posts. If I was here to convince people I would be approaching you all like a sales man. (Identifying want or need in all posts and up selling specific aspects of God to full fill your needs while down playing the bad.) Rather I think I do the opposite. I offer truth whether it hurts or helps my argument. I don't try and make things seem nice at the expense of the truth.

That's why I did not make an effort to soften my approach to nympho. He/she needed truth not sympathy.

Truth and a accurate picture of God is what I offer. You all decide after that. I am not here to 'save' anyone. I am here to provide you with the information one can use to make an informed decision, what you do with that opportunity will be between you and God.

I offer truth, says the unconvincing man, who has no desire to convince us - or sell a product. There isn't anything between me and god at the moment, except for you, purportedly. You've managed to really fuck up the opportunity to deliver this information, huh?

(May 12, 2016 at 3:04 pm)drfuzzy Wrote:

(May 12, 2016 at 2:10 pm)Drich Wrote: Now before I kick you in your teeth with a obvious point your missed, and dismount you from your 'high horse' do you want to go back and reread what my argument actual says. Hint: I did NOT say Christianity is the oldest recorded religion.

How typical of a preacher to threaten violence.  No, you said that there were no "texts".  (Literal quote: "surviving documents") There are a LOT of surviving documents that describe religions thousands of years earlier than xtianity.  Just because a hieroglyph isn't passed around today in book form as an Egyptian "bible" does not mean that it was not a "text", and it does not mean that the stories it contained were not "sacred" to the people who wrote them.

Okay, just remember I gave you a chance:

Quote:I completely understand the argument. However there is a problem with it. The "text" that have been proven older than the bible do not lend themselves to the bible stories as promised. The texts that do, have no surviving manuscripts older than the bible. Meaning even IF that particular religion is older the writings of it could have been taken from the bible, not the other way around.

from post 195

Do you understand???

I am Saying That those who are older than Christianity do not lend themselves to the biblical narrative. Meaning their stories and the Gospel are not similar.

Again I am not saying their are older text. I am saying those that are can't be used as examples of "religious borrowing" The examples people use are either inaccurate or are from religions who's religious text post date the bible even if the religion itself has been known to exist before Christianity.

Even with our 'vast knoweledge' of the Greek pantheon of gods our earliest complete work is from the 15th century.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bibliothec...lodorus%29

As far as the Egyptians are concerned even less is known. Yes we have papyrus, tomb paintings, and various scraps and pieces of stories from one place or another, but in truth that's all we have. scraps. bits and pieces we have cobbled together from what is left of that society. In truth we don't even know what we don't know. as their is not one example or even anything close to a narrative that ties everything together. we just have what we currently think. Fact of the matter is the new kingdom/the reign of the Ramses deleted anything that was not of their system of belief.

Kind like someone trying to piece together what an ISIS held city believed 4000 years after they destroyed defaced and looted everything. We are currently cobbling together everything from the three dynasties into one big giant all encompassing narrative when infact some believe that everything attributed to the Egyptians could be from another unknown society all together. while the Egyptians reused and painted over what was left behind.

(May 12, 2016 at 3:17 pm)Nymphadora Wrote: Dripshit you are the lowest form of low. You call yourself a christian, yet refuse to act according to what you believe. You are a cumstain on the pillowcase of life and nothing more than a bad choice your mama made when she spread her legs.

I think you secretly obsess about what sort of upset you're going to cause here when you get up in the morning. For that I find you abhorrent. Your posts here today towards me were nothing more than ignorant, rude and they intentionally hit below the belt. Shame on you. You are a morally reprehensible thing. I can't even call you a human because you fall far beneath humans on the food chain. You're more like a bottom feeder because you actively seek out and cause hurt whenever you can by feeding off of people's emotions. You are an infuriating little cunt of a man who has zero tact and zero empathy. You take people's vulnerabilities and exploit them to suit your own agenda. You don't just do it here. You do it all over this forum.

You disgust me. You disgust many on here. I'd liken you to a small child who doesn't grasp the concept of doing the right thing, but I can't because eventually even a child can learn what the right thing is. You however, disregard the feelings of others just to make a point about your stupid, narcissistic god. The two of you deserve each other. Neither of you are capable of "doing the right thing". Ever.

Now kindly go fuck yourself with a sharpened stick. The pointy end. Make sure you stick it so far up your ass that it pierces what little brain you have. Asshole.

What part of what I believe am I not being consistent with?

(May 12, 2016 at 2:52 pm)Stimbo Wrote:

Quote:Then perhaps you shouldn't draw lines you don't want crossed.

That's exactly what lines are for, Drich - establishing boundaries.

If you wear your heart on your sleeve and dare people to stab at it, you can't make them out to be bad people when they do. I do not see any you people as bad just because you question what I have shared. Nor will I. That is why I only share what I am willing to fully explore or discuss. My boundaries begin and end with what I choose to discuss. It real simple. One can not cross a line if they do not know it exists.

If nympho did not willing share his abuse, then I would have never guessed it happened. let alone comment on it.