(May 4, 2016 at 7:30 am)ignoramus Wrote: FM, why couldn't the turtle simply have flipped the other turtle in order to have sex with it? No compassion or morals involved. Just the instinct to reproduce.

It has to be a bitch if you don't have arms and hands.

(May 3, 2016 at 7:58 pm)Cecelia Wrote: A thought occurred to me.  What if the bible were far more pleasant?  Instead of stories of Adam and Eve getting kicked out of the Garden of Eden, of God flooding the world, and of Hebrews stoning people... you'd find stories of God actually showing what we consider kindness.  No laws against working on Sunday, or disbelievers going to hell, or eating shellfish, or gay people. 

Take out some of the scientific inaccuracies, the sexism, the homophobia, the genocidal rage, etc... and replace it with more pleasant things.  For example the ideas of feeding the poor being important, while also allowing gay people to get married, being against slavery, etc...  Instead of saying the world is only 6000 years old, it might make no claim to the age of the Earth.  

Do you think you'd still be a believer if the bible were more pleasant and less inaccurate?

I'm inclined to think that I would be.  Obviously there would still be a lack of evidence.  But I think most people believe because they already find the bible rather pleasant.  They don't like the idea of gay people having sex, so they aren't bothered by the idea that God forbids gay people having sex.  They can accept it with ease because they are comfortable with it.  I'm willing to admit that if I was far more comfortable with it, I think I'd still be a believer.  It's not the only reason I disbelieve now, of course.  But take the inaccuracies out too, and I doubt I'd still be an Atheist even without proof of god.  I'd probably be like many theists are now, and not need proof, other than my own confirmation bias.  I'd like to think I'm more intelligent than that, but I don't think that I am.

Other ethnocentric religious fairy tales have nicer deities so why don't you believe one of them?

"What's this book you keep shoving in my face daddy?"

"It's the bible."

"What is that?"

"It's the word of God."

"Wow, great! Let's see..... talking snake? What's going on daddy?"

"Haha, you don't actually believe that happened do you? You're a fucking idiot! Hahahaha! It's obviously a metaphor for something or other!"

"Of course, how foolish of me daddy. I'm glad you're here to filter the word of God for me. Otherwise I might have believed what it actually says."

(May 5, 2016 at 5:39 am)LastPoet Wrote: To me it was heartbreaking to know the priest drank white wine in the blood of christ BS. I mean, at least use RED wine.

White wine goes with fish stories.

(May 12, 2016 at 3:23 am)Wyrd of Gawd Wrote: Other ethnocentric religious fairy tales have nicer deities so why don't you believe one of them?

Because I wasn't raised to believe in them.  Being a believer is much easier when you're raised into it.  If I were born into a more rational/nicer religion, I'd have probably continued rationalizing it.  I'd have been comfortable not having answers to questions that were raised.

(May 12, 2016 at 7:52 pm)Cecelia Wrote: Because I wasn't raised to believe in them.  Being a believer is much easier when you're raised into it.  If I were born into a more rational/nicer religion, I'd have probably continued rationalizing it.  I'd have been comfortable not having answers to questions that were raised.

Given my level of education, I can't see myself taking that path. Biology and Paleonthology would always have interfered with any belief I can possibly imagine. At least as far as scripted deities, concerned over humans, go. Even more so, since I didn't give the abysmal stories of the bible much thought anyway. So that was certainly the least important reason to give up whatever faith was left in me.

(May 3, 2016 at 7:58 pm)Cecelia Wrote: A thought occurred to me.  What if the bible were far more pleasant?  Instead of stories of Adam and Eve getting kicked out of the Garden of Eden, of God flooding the world, and of Hebrews stoning people... you'd find stories of God actually showing what we consider kindness.  No laws against working on Sunday, or disbelievers going to hell, or eating shellfish, or gay people. 

Take out some of the scientific inaccuracies, the sexism, the homophobia, the genocidal rage, etc... and replace it with more pleasant things.  For example the ideas of feeding the poor being important, while also allowing gay people to get married, being against slavery, etc...  Instead of saying the world is only 6000 years old, it might make no claim to the age of the Earth.  

Do you think you'd still be a believer if the bible were more pleasant and less inaccurate?

I'm inclined to think that I would be.  Obviously there would still be a lack of evidence.  But I think most people believe because they already find the bible rather pleasant.  They don't like the idea of gay people having sex, so they aren't bothered by the idea that God forbids gay people having sex.  They can accept it with ease because they are comfortable with it.  I'm willing to admit that if I was far more comfortable with it, I think I'd still be a believer.  It's not the only reason I disbelieve now, of course.  But take the inaccuracies out too, and I doubt I'd still be an Atheist even without proof of god.  I'd probably be like many theists are now, and not need proof, other than my own confirmation bias.  I'd like to think I'm more intelligent than that, but I don't think that I am.

The biblical stories are designed to teach obedience and belief without exception.  The God character was simply the series of men who ruled the dominant Middle Eastern Empire at any given time.  Their word was absolute, except for the rare occasions when people flipped them off.  

That system is still in operation today.  If you are an average person you obey your leader and follow his laws just as the characters in the biblical stories followed the God character and his laws.  We consider some of the biblical laws to be asinine; a lot of our secular laws are also asinine.  The God character told his minions to run over the hill and kill people they didn't even know.  Our leaders tell us to do the same thing and we gladly do it without a second thought.  When we break a rule and don't get caught we "sin", such as running a stop sign or speeding on an empty road.  

If we curse our leaders (our gods) we will get punished if we live in the wrong place at the wrong time, such as in Thailand.  They get ticked off when people make fun of their silly king.  There are Bible stories about that.  

A lot of the biblical stories are designed to show people how to make it through the day without getting killed for breaking the bigwig's rules.  

Learn from observing other peoples' mistakes because it may save your neck.  That's the real purpose of the biblical stories.

I think what peopke need to think about is that you might not have gotten down the path that eventionally led to unbelief

(May 16, 2016 at 7:48 pm)Mothonis Wrote: I think what peopke need to think about is that you might not have gotten down the path that eventionally led to unbelief

But in my case it would have taken not to attend school. What I learned in science class threw god out of the window.

(May 16, 2016 at 7:53 pm)abaris Wrote:

(May 16, 2016 at 7:48 pm)Mothonis Wrote: I think what peopke need to think about is that you might not have gotten down the path that eventionally led to unbelief

But in my case it would have taken not to attend school. What I learned in science class threw god out of the window.

Yes some people are different,but for many it was how outrageus the book was that made them really question the validity of faith