(November 19, 2016 at 12:34 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: You clearly weren't paying attention to his campaign, then. Did you not hear his comments about Mexicans and rapists? He only backpedaled from that after he got called out on it ... which was his standard MO anyway. Those of his followers who were bigots loved him for saying that, and forgave him his "clarifying" because they knew his racism was unpalatable to the broader masses of voters.

At least, they thought it was. Turns out it was quite palatable.

More importantly, you don't get an endorsment from the KKK and David Duke for nothing. First candidate ever to draw them aboard. They got the message just fine. And before anyone comes along saying, the poor guy just couldn't help himself, a look at his staffers tells a different tale. Steve Bannon sticks out like a sore thumb.

I would say, if it walks like a duck and quaks like a duck .....

(November 19, 2016 at 11:41 am)Rhythm Wrote: The "I can't be racist if I don't think it's racist" defense of racism.

More like you have yet to prove it was racist in the first place.

What could -I- say to establish that trumps campaign was racist if the things trump already said don't do that, for you?  

"You haven't proven that piece of paper is blue!"
"It's a leftist conspiracy to call it blue!"

We could do this all day Napo, but I'd rather not.

(November 19, 2016 at 12:58 pm)Rhythm Wrote: What could -I- say to establish that trumps campaign was racist if the things trump already said don't do that, for you?  

Don't try to convince a groupie, who's so not bigoted and so not a white nationalist and probably creaming his pants right now over having something like that at home. To finally being able to let lose.

I don't, I just point and laugh. Not much else -to- do.

(November 19, 2016 at 9:55 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Kusa that was mean 

But Brian is a verbally abusive SJW that lives in a glass house.

(November 19, 2016 at 12:51 pm)Napoléon Wrote: It's a point about border control. Unless you want to say to me he said all Mexicans are rapists then you don't have a leg to stand on.

Well, there's your problem, right there. In his original comment, he went through a litany of the problems Mexicans were allegedly bringing to America and at the end of that litany, he said, "... and I have to assume that some are good too." Appending this caveat of "assuming" some are good "too" after asserting, as bare fact, that Mexico was sending "rapists" (with no "assuming" it, simply stating it as bare fact) is your clue here.

His point, anyway, is not about border control. You see, half of the illegal aliens in America aren't here from Mexico as a result of sneaking across the southern border. They're here because they overstayed visas, and they're from many, many countries. The fact that he's going to take care of illegal immigration by only tackling one half of it -- the visible, brown half, y'know) is another datum that you clearly haven't introduced into your ill-advised thinking here.

Simply because you like the guy doesn't mean he's not racist, nor does it mean you are racist.

He's got a long history of racist behavior. I don't blame you for not knowing this stuff, because after all, it's not your own country, your own leader, that we're discussing. But not all opinions are equal, and yours certainly won't be until you can explain his behavior in terms other than racism. That is the prism he himself has used.

(November 19, 2016 at 1:05 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:

(November 19, 2016 at 12:51 pm)Napoléon Wrote: It's a point about border control. Unless you want to say to me he said all Mexicans are rapists then you don't have a leg to stand on.

Well, there's your problem, right there.  In his original comment, he went through a litany of the problems Mexicans were allegedly bringing to America and at the end of that litany, he said, "... and I have to assume that some are good too." Appending this caveat of "assuming" some are good "too" after asserting, as bare fact, that Mexico was sending "rapists" (with no "assuming" it, simply stating it as bare fact) is your clue here.

His point, anyway, is not about border control. You see, half of the illegal aliens in America aren't here from Mexico as a result of sneaking across the southern border. They're here because they overstayed visas, and they're from many, many countries. The fact that he's going to take care of illegal immigration by only tackling one half of it -- the visible, brown half, y'know) is another datum that you clearly haven't introduced into your ill-advised thinking here.

Simply because you like the guy doesn't mean he's not racist, nor does it mean you are racist.

He's got a long history of racist behavior. I don't blame you for not knowing this stuff, because after all, it's not your own country, your own leader, that we're discussing. But not all opinions are equal, and yours certainly won't be until you can explain his behavior in terms other than racism. That is the prism he himself has used.

My bold.

Does he actually like Trump though? Or is he simply sharing a different, benefit-of-the-doubt type perspective?

(November 19, 2016 at 11:41 am)Rhythm Wrote:

(November 19, 2016 at 6:56 am)Napoléon Wrote: Again, just entirely ignoring the fact that many don't interpret his campaign as racist. Again, a false dilemma. Just you saying it's so, don't make it so. Your whole point hinges on it being absolutely concrete that Trump and his campaign and his policies are explicitly racist. I think you're sipping the left wing kool aid if you think that's anywhere near a certainty.

The "I can't be racist if I don't think it's racist" defense of racism.

That's facetious and intellectually dishonest of you. 

(November 19, 2016 at 12:18 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:

(November 19, 2016 at 10:05 am)Excited Penguin Wrote: Doesn't that make you a bigot, though ?

Uh, no. Nice stretch, though. Perhaps you should reread the post I referenced so you can understand my point ... because right now you clearly don't.

Or maybe you do understand my point and are pretending otherwise in an attempt to rile me, per your usual MO.

At any rate, we'll resume this conversation when your brain resumes useful operations.

Which post would that be? The one you replied to directly or the one in which you said you had charged bigotry? Hey, why don't you just fucking tell me what you mean, Princess, I won't read through hundreds of posts just to get at the bit you might want me to seek out. . . Only to then have you double down on your own inept remarks without even attempting to hold an honest conversation about them. 

I am not deliberately obstructing this conversation. If you're not able to have it, then don't. I'm not holding your feet to the fire here. My impression of you doesn't really allow for much caring on that front. 

(November 19, 2016 at 12:34 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:

(November 19, 2016 at 6:56 am)Napoléon Wrote: Your whole point hinges on it being absolutely concrete that Trump and his campaign and his policies are explicitly racist.

You clearly weren't paying attention to his campaign, then. Did you not hear his comments about Mexicans and rapists? He only backpedaled from that after he got called out on it ... which was his standard MO anyway. Those of his followers who were bigots loved him for saying that, and forgave him his "clarifying" because they knew his racism was unpalatable to the broader masses of voters.

At least, they thought it was. Turns out it was quite palatable.

Quote:Those of his followers who were bigots

How do you know if someone's a bigot, Thump? Do aknowledge the subjective fucking nature of your own opinion on the matter, please. 

(November 19, 2016 at 12:41 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:

(November 19, 2016 at 9:05 am)Bella Morte Wrote: I know you weren't talking to me, but are you referring to the "alt-right" Twitter accounts that Trump retweeted? It is possible that he just retweeted them without checking the profiles.

Well, that makes everything okay. Seriously, what you're saying is, it's great that he shares these opinions of bigots, but he should look for cleaner sources next time. I'm responsible for everything I post, here and elsewhere, and if I quote someone, I'm responsible for that, too. It's called being an adult.

I don't see that Bella said that. You're intentionally taking what she said and adding your own illegitimate spin on it. 

I don't understand your definition of adulthood or how it relates to this,but I think you need to develop some nuance. 

(November 19, 2016 at 12:44 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:

(November 19, 2016 at 10:57 am)Napoléon Wrote: Hitler loved animals. I guess everyone who loves animals is a nazi.

Oh wait, no, that's not how it works is it?

Inapt analogy.

Think it through and repost something better. Here, I've got an example for you: Hitler quoted Julius Streicher. That made him a NaZi.

Trust me, it's really not that hard ... once you get used to it.

That made whom a Nazi and why? 

Could you be more condescending ?

(November 19, 2016 at 12:58 pm)Rhythm Wrote: What could -I- say to establish that trumps campaign was racist if the things trump already said don't do that, for you?  

"You haven't proven that piece of paper is blue!"
"It's a leftist conspiracy to call it blue!"

We could do this all day Napo, but I'd rather not.

Racism is irrelevant , for that reason. I don't care for people's thoughts or feelings , only for their actions.