(April 18, 2017 at 7:25 am)Little Rik Wrote:

Quote:Given that even you admit a connection between mind and matter... the pineal gland and the energy that supplies it, what's to say that the NDE's that you're so fond of mentioning aren't exactly that... in your terms, a disruption to the energy that supplies the pineal gland, that results in a 'severely altered state of consciousness', and in my terms, a severely altered state of consciousness that results from the damage/disruption caused by a dying brain?

You don't getting Em, do you?  
NDEs only happen when the brain is dead not when is dying.

This is bullshit and you've been corrected on it before. The brain continues to live on for about 6 minutes after cardiac arrest, during which it is accurately described as 'dying' not as 'dead'. After those 6 minutes the brain starts to become truly dead, and once vital areas of the brain have died, there is no coming back to tell the experience of an NDE. They are then dead, finis, kaput. Not before.

Quote:The brain can survive for up to about six minutes after the heart stops. The reason to learn cardiopulmonary resuscitation (CPR) is that if CPR is started within six minutes of cardiac arrest, the brain may survive the lack of oxygen. After about six minutes without CPR, however, the brain begins to die.

http://science.howstuffworks.com/life/in...death1.htm

Don't you ever get tired of lying about these things?

(April 18, 2017 at 10:29 am)AceBoogie Wrote:

(April 18, 2017 at 7:25 am)Little Rik Wrote: Calm down Ace and read here.......So even if there is any argument for a deist god, it simply comes from lack of knowledge of the origins of Earth and/or the Universe........
This is what you posted in the previous page yesterday or before yesterday.

From your sentence I understood that because some people do not understand the origins of the Earth-Universe you obviously know that.
How could you judge these people otherwise?
Only someone who knows or pretend to know the truth can judge and because you did judge these people you put yourself in a position to know, that is why i did asked you such a thing.
Do you get it now?  

---

So can you show me where I claimed to know of the origins of the universe? Or no?

The sentence you highlighted is a claim about the argument for a deist god. Not about the origins of the universe. You're not very bright, Rik.

Wrong again Ace.
By saying that some people have a ..........lack of knowledge of the origins of Earth and/or the Universe..........you automatically make a judgement and by making a judgement you automatically put yourself in a position to know or suppose to know the truth.
And if you know the truth you should answer my question.
If not you talk crap.  

---

(April 18, 2017 at 10:34 am)Jörmungandr Wrote:

(April 18, 2017 at 7:25 am)Little Rik Wrote: You don't getting Em, do you?  
NDEs only happen when the brain is dead not when is dying.

This is bullshit and you've been corrected on it before.  The brain continues to live on for about 6 minutes after cardiac arrest, during which it is accurately described as 'dying' not as 'dead'.  After those 6 minutes the brain starts to become truly dead, and once vital areas of the brain have died, there is no coming back to tell the experience of an NDE.  They are then dead, finis, kaput.  Not before.

Quote:The brain can survive for up to about six minutes after the heart stops. The reason to learn cardiopulmonary resuscitation (CPR) is that if CPR is started within six minutes of cardiac arrest, the brain may survive the lack of oxygen. After about six minutes without CPR, however, the brain begins to die.

http://science.howstuffworks.com/life/in...death1.htm

Don't you ever get tired of lying about these things?

Fail once again Yog.    

First of all your link say..........The brain can survive for up to about six minutes after the heart stops.

Do you know what the word CAN mean in this case?  
It means that it can as well as it can not.
It depend on the situations so all your impetus zeal to contradict me just goes down the sewer but
that's not all Yog.
Most people who had an NDE could see their bodies lie or in the casualty of the hospital or where some accident took place that clearly means that the consciousness separate from the body-brain beside
a brain in trouble can not possibly put together an experience clear, sharp and vivid that is remembered after years and years that took place.

Try again Yog but please less garbage next time.  
Have a good day dear.  

(April 18, 2017 at 10:34 am)Jörmungandr Wrote:

(April 18, 2017 at 7:25 am)Little Rik Wrote: You don't getting Em, do you?  
NDEs only happen when the brain is dead not when is dying.

This is bullshit and you've been corrected on it before.  The brain continues to live on for about 6 minutes after cardiac arrest, during which it is accurately described as 'dying' not as 'dead'.  After those 6 minutes the brain starts to become truly dead, and once vital areas of the brain have died, there is no coming back to tell the experience of an NDE.  They are then dead, finis, kaput.  Not before.

Quote:The brain can survive for up to about six minutes after the heart stops. The reason to learn cardiopulmonary resuscitation (CPR) is that if CPR is started within six minutes of cardiac arrest, the brain may survive the lack of oxygen. After about six minutes without CPR, however, the brain begins to die.

http://science.howstuffworks.com/life/in...death1.htm

Don't you ever get tired of lying about these things?

BINGO! Thank you. This bullshit about NDEs is not only scientifically absurd, it is also insulting to me personally having watched my mom die. 

If someone comes out of an event, it only means there was just barely enough motion/activity to allow the brain to recover. But once the brain is damaged beyond repair and is completely dead with no motion/activity you dont come back. 

As I said in a prior post, it is horrible to watch someone die. My mom's lips and mouth were twitching which was nothing more than the brain dying shooting off the last bit of neurological activity, then it completely stopped. I went into her room after her death and her hands were pasty white. Her consciousness was no more. 

This crap humans claim about an afterlife is just a human projection of our evolutionary drive to continue. It is a very false perception. I love my mom, I miss her but I am not going to lie to myself and pretend fictional things exist.

---

There is a huge difference between clinical death, which can be a misdiagnosis where the nurse/doctor/medical device cant detect motion/activity, and that can be merely flying under the radar, but still have just enough there to later come back and be detected. But after too much damage beyond repair after that window of time has completely closed, YOU DONT COME BACK. Once your brain dies BEYOND repair you DONT come back.

(April 19, 2017 at 6:06 am)Little Rik Wrote: Most people who had an NDE could see their bodies lie or in the casualty of the hospital or where some accident took place that clearly means that the consciousness separate from the body-brain beside

Hardly.  I can see myself in dreams as well, doing all sorts of strange shit, and even in the third person.  Creating a third person perspective of ourselves and our environment is well within the means of our waking or sleeping mind..and, apparently..can happen before, during or after an nde.

Quote:a brain in trouble can not possibly put together an experience clear, sharp and vivid that is remembered after years and years that took place.

-that ought to make you suspicious of nde accounts, if you think it's true..actually. How -could- a brain in trouble possibly put together an experience clear, sharp and vivid? Is what's remembered years later actually what happened?

(April 19, 2017 at 6:06 am)Little Rik Wrote:

(April 18, 2017 at 10:29 am)AceBoogie Wrote: So can you show me where I claimed to know of the origins of the universe? Or no?

The sentence you highlighted is a claim about the argument for a deist god. Not about the origins of the universe. You're not very bright, Rik.

Wrong again Ace.
By saying that some people have a ..........lack of knowledge of the origins of Earth and/or the Universe..........you automatically make a judgement and by making a judgement you automatically put yourself in a position to know or suppose to know the truth.
And if you know the truth you should answer my question.
If not you talk crap.  

---

(April 18, 2017 at 10:34 am)Jörmungandr Wrote: This is bullshit and you've been corrected on it before.  The brain continues to live on for about 6 minutes after cardiac arrest, during which it is accurately described as 'dying' not as 'dead'.  After those 6 minutes the brain starts to become truly dead, and once vital areas of the brain have died, there is no coming back to tell the experience of an NDE.  They are then dead, finis, kaput.  Not before.


Don't you ever get tired of lying about these things?

Fail once again Yog.    

First of all your link say..........The brain can survive for up to about six minutes after the heart stops.

Do you know what the word CAN mean in this case?  
It means that it can as well as it can not.
It depend on the situations so all your impetus zeal to contradict me just goes down the sewer but
that's not all Yog.
Most people who had an NDE could see their bodies lie or in the casualty of the hospital or where some accident took place that clearly means that the consciousness separate from the body-brain beside
a brain in trouble can not possibly put together an experience clear, sharp and vivid that is remembered after years and years that took place.

Try again Yog but please less garbage next time.  
Have a good day dear.  

The bullshit term "NEAR DEATH EXPERIENCE" gives it away, "NEAR" not beyond the window. That isn't after permanent death, thus the word "NEAR". Nobody survives death after that window has closed. If you survive you still had enough in you to come back.

NDE's are simply humans false perceptions of their natural brain activity. The brain goes through a shutdown and sometimes you can come out of that shutdown, but after the window has closed BEYOND repair you don't come back.

Hallucinations are your brain dumping out your files due to heavy medication and or hypoxia and that sensation can feel very real, but it is still nothing more than your hallucination. If you spent a lifetime being told bullshit claims of souls and spirits and afterlife, your hallucinations are going to reflect the lives you interacted with, your memories and mix with the fairy tales you swallowed in that time. 

If you are raised Hindu or Sikh in India  have a NDE in India your "experience" will involve India's superstitions and social norms and will involve your family members and friends who buy into that superstition too. If you are born in Saudi Arabia and raised Sunni Muslim and have a NDE, again, your false perception of a hallucination will involve the superstitions and beliefs of Muslims. If you are born in Tibet and raised Buddhist, and have a "NDE" again, same thing, your false perception will involve your memories of family friends and the superstitions they buy into.

BUT none of that is real. It is no different than if really want to believe the covered olives in the dark kitchen on Halloween night are really eyeballs, you will believe it.

(April 19, 2017 at 6:06 am)Little Rik Wrote:

(April 18, 2017 at 7:25 am)Little Rik Wrote: You don't getting Em, do you?  
NDEs only happen when the brain is dead not when is dying.

(April 18, 2017 at 10:34 am)Jörmungandr Wrote: This is bullshit and you've been corrected on it before.  The brain continues to live on for about 6 minutes after cardiac arrest, during which it is accurately described as 'dying' not as 'dead'.  After those 6 minutes the brain starts to become truly dead, and once vital areas of the brain have died, there is no coming back to tell the experience of an NDE.  They are then dead, finis, kaput.  Not before.


Don't you ever get tired of lying about these things?

Fail once again Yog.    

First of all your link say..........The brain can survive for up to about six minutes after the heart stops.

Do you know what the word CAN mean in this case?  
It means that it can as well as it can not.
It depend on the situations so all your impetus zeal to contradict me just goes down the sewer

You're a fucking moron.  If the brain is dead then there is no coming back from the experience to tell an NDE you stupid cluck.  That's the contradiction between what you're saying and what happens.  An NDE cannot happen when the brain is dead because then it wouldn't be a NEAR death experience but an ACTUAL death experience.  So no, it doesn't depend upon any "situation" you clueless moron.

(April 19, 2017 at 6:06 am)Little Rik Wrote: but that's not all Yog.
Most people who had an NDE could see their bodies lie or in the casualty of the hospital or where some accident took place that clearly means that the consciousness separate from the body-brain beside

OR it clearly means that they hallucinate seeing their bodies (see here for examples of out-of-body discrepancies).  You BELIEVE that they are actually seeing their bodies from outside of them.  Your 'belief' doesn't count for shit when we have clear evidence that these experiences are generated by the brain itself and have nothing to do with any consciousness separating from the body.  Yours is just a claim that consciousness separates from the body.  You keep making this claim and when asked to back it up you disingenuously point to a website filled with irrelevant NDE accounts and ask us to go digging.  That's bullshit, that's not providing evidence for your claim.  As can be seen from the evidence linked above, OBEs are CLEARLY hallucinations.

(April 19, 2017 at 6:06 am)Little Rik Wrote: a brain in trouble can not possibly put together an experience clear, sharp and vivid that is remembered after years and years that took place.

Yet another claim without backing.  You've been repeatedly informed that G induced loss of consciousness and also the drug ketamine can produce clear, sharp, and vivid hallucinations which are similar to those experienced in an NDE (here, here, and here).  So you know that it's not only possible, but actual.

You just keep repeating the same claims over and over again, and never answer the contrary evidence.  It's either because you're a dishonest ass, or because you're too stoopid to learn from experience.  Either way, I don't care.  It's nothing but lying as far as I'm concerned.

(April 19, 2017 at 6:06 am)Little Rik Wrote: Try again Yog but please less garbage next time.  
Have a good day dear.  

You go fuck yourself.

Wherever there are strong hallucinating drugs, nothing can be trusted. The brain produces these; you can make sure by watching videos of dying people -people who got hacked alive or shot-; some smile and spit nonsense, they are hallucinating. 

As long as the brain is alive, it cannot be trusted. NDEs look similar because the drug the brain produces is the same.

(April 19, 2017 at 10:37 am)AtlasS33 Wrote: Wherever there are strong hallucinating drugs, nothing can be trusted. The brain produces these; you can make sure by watching videos of dying people -people who got hacked alive or shot-; some smile and spit nonsense, they are hallucinating. 

As long as the brain is alive, it cannot be trusted. NDEs look similar because the drug the brain produces is the same.

Bolded mine.  What does that mean?

(April 19, 2017 at 10:40 am)FatAndFaithless Wrote:

(April 19, 2017 at 10:37 am)AtlasS33 Wrote: Wherever there are strong hallucinating drugs, nothing can be trusted. The brain produces these; you can make sure by watching videos of dying people -people who got hacked alive or shot-; some smile and spit nonsense, they are hallucinating. 

As long as the brain is alive, it cannot be trusted. NDEs look similar because the drug the brain produces is the same.

Bolded mine.  What does that mean?

It's a near death experience; not "total death experience".

If the brain is alive, and it was proven that it produces drugs at the moment of death, or near death, and hence: the drugs produced indices hallucinations, then it cannot be trusted to tell what was real, and what was a production of the drugs.

(April 19, 2017 at 10:50 am)AtlasS33 Wrote:

(April 19, 2017 at 10:40 am)FatAndFaithless Wrote: Bolded mine.  What does that mean?

It's a near death experience; not "total death experience".

If the brain is alive, and it was proven that it produces drugs at the moment of death, or near death, and hence: the drugs produced indices hallucinations, then it cannot be trusted to tell what was real, and what was a production of the drugs.

Well that's something I think you'll find most people here agree with you on.