(May 2, 2017 at 5:32 pm)Grandizer Wrote:

(May 2, 2017 at 4:57 pm)Huggy74 Wrote: Forgiveness has nothing to do the offender, it is solely at the discretion of the person offended, besides there are somethings you just cant conceivably "earn" forgiveness for, like murder for example.

Not necessarily true. It is up to the offended to offer the forgiveness, but if the offender has shown a maintained repentant attitude that is clear to the offended in their words and actions and is satisfying enough to the offended, then it is possible to be forgiven for such things as murder.

I'm not saying that it's not possible for someone to be forgiven for murder, I'm saying it's not possible to earn forgiveness for murder. That implies that forgiveness can be deserved.

(May 2, 2017 at 6:46 pm)Huggy74 Wrote:

(May 2, 2017 at 5:32 pm)Grandizer Wrote: Not necessarily true. It is up to the offended to offer the forgiveness, but if the offender has shown a maintained repentant attitude that is clear to the offended in their words and actions and is satisfying enough to the offended, then it is possible to be forgiven for such things as murder.

I'm not saying that it's not possible for someone to be forgiven for murder, I'm saying it's not possible to earn forgiveness for murder. That implies that forgiveness can be deserved.

If you truly believe that forgiveness can never be earned or deserved then I hope your world view dies a rapid death.

(May 2, 2017 at 8:03 pm)The Gentleman Bastard Wrote:

(May 2, 2017 at 6:46 pm)Huggy74 Wrote: I'm not saying that it's not possible for someone to be forgiven for murder, I'm saying it's not possible to earn forgiveness for murder. That implies that forgiveness can be deserved.

If you truly believe that forgiveness can never be earned or deserved then I hope your world view dies a rapid death.

especially due to the fact we just showed it can be both

(May 2, 2017 at 6:46 pm)Huggy74 Wrote:

(May 2, 2017 at 5:32 pm)Grandizer Wrote: Not necessarily true. It is up to the offended to offer the forgiveness, but if the offender has shown a maintained repentant attitude that is clear to the offended in their words and actions and is satisfying enough to the offended, then it is possible to be forgiven for such things as murder.

I'm not saying that it's not possible for someone to be forgiven for murder, I'm saying it's not possible to earn forgiveness for murder. That implies that forgiveness can be deserved.

(May 1, 2017 at 5:26 pm)Lutrinae Wrote:

(May 1, 2017 at 3:30 pm)Drich Wrote: Maybe it is you who has fooled himself into think that just because you dad beat on you are justified in hating someone forever.

Forgiveness is akin to respect, either of which must be earned rather than merely doled out on lame principle.

Ah.. no.

Forgiveness is a condition of the heart. it simply means one lets go any debt due them by the debtor/sinner.

You can do this and not respect the one you forgive. You simply let go what you think is owed you.

(May 2, 2017 at 8:03 pm)The Gentleman Bastard Wrote:

(May 2, 2017 at 6:46 pm)Huggy74 Wrote: I'm not saying that it's not possible for someone to be forgiven for murder, I'm saying it's not possible to earn forgiveness for murder. That implies that forgiveness can be deserved.

If you truly believe that forgiveness can never be earned or deserved then I hope your world view dies a rapid death.

*sigh*

Once again... Forgiveness has nothing to do with the offender. The families of Dylan Roofs victims forgave him... that's THEIR prerogative to do so, their is nothing Dylan Roof could do to make up for killing 9 people. So saying one could earn forgiveness in this case is asinine.