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RE: Rebellion against god
February 27, 2018 at 5:18 pm
(This post was last modified: February 27, 2018 at 5:19 pm by Fake Messiah.)
(February 27, 2018 at 3:41 pm)Banned Wrote: Firstly, you don't believe that God exists or that he rewards those who diligently seek him, or that the Bible is the means that God has chosen to educate believers and prepare them for eternal life. Until you yield to God, you will not have the capacity to see the vidence, even though the universe and everything in it was created by God.
Even you know that what you just wrote is total bullshit. Many people have "yielded to God" (Jesus) and yet they completely failed to be educated since there are many thousands of different Christianities that preach different things. Like some Christianities still cling to flat Earth while others concluded that biological evolution is true and yet I bet you're not one of them. Also your own division of Christianity believed Jesus will come on Earth on specific dates and failed - so much of yielding to Jesus to know the Bible.
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
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RE: Rebellion against god
February 27, 2018 at 5:19 pm
(This post was last modified: February 27, 2018 at 5:23 pm by Banned.)
(February 27, 2018 at 4:54 pm)Tizheruk Wrote: Quote:Speaking of rage - because it has something to do with the topic of rebellion - what do you have to lose if you yielded to Christ, or is your rage dear to you?
I lose my integrity and my self respect .
And i gain nothing by yielding to your so called god .
Love isn't about going somewhere to gain something for yourself, God has everything he wants except your friendship, the very reason he made the universe in the first place - to have you around.
(February 27, 2018 at 5:18 pm)Fake Messiah Wrote: Even you know that what you just wrote is total bullshit. Many people have "yielded to God" (Jesus) and yet they completely failed to be educated since there are many thousands of different Christianities that preach different things. Like some Christianities still cling to flat Earth while others concluded that biological evolution is true and yet I bet you're not one of them. Also your own division of Christianity believed Jesus will come on Earth on specific dates and failed - so much of yielding to Jesus to know the Bible.
You would be happy to know that yielding to Christ means to accept truth as it comes along as well. People will make a religious claim, but don't follow on to know truth - about themselves, about the universe and God.
So flat earth and a hundred other things are wrong.
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RE: Rebellion against god
February 27, 2018 at 5:28 pm
(This post was last modified: February 27, 2018 at 5:28 pm by Amarok.)
Quote:Love isn't about going somewhere to gain something for yourself, God has everything he wants except your friendship, the very reason he made the universe in the first place - to have you around
Your the won who brought up loss and gain . I simply answered . You god clearly has no interest in my friendship or love as either come from demands of yielding or submission or ownership . Those are the terms of an enemy not a friend . As for the reason it's assumed i was made it seems to again have nothing to do with friendship or love . But slavery .
Quote:You would be happy to know that yielding to Christ means to accept truth as it comes along as well. People will make a religious claim, but don't follow on to know truth - about themselves, about the universe and God.
So flat earth and a hundred other things are wrong.
Excuses .
Seek strength, not to be greater than my brother, but to fight my greatest enemy -- myself.
Inuit Proverb
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RE: Rebellion against god
February 27, 2018 at 5:39 pm
(February 27, 2018 at 5:19 pm)Banned Wrote: You would be happy to know that yielding to Christ means to accept truth as it comes along as well. People will make a religious claim, but don't follow on to know truth - about themselves, about the universe and God.
So flat earth and a hundred other things are wrong.
Yeah "hundred other things are wrong" like worshiping Sunday. Majority of Christian denomination worship Sunday and claim if you don't go to Church on Sunday will make you burn in Hell while yours worships Saturday, so majority of Christians just fail to "yield to Christ".
It seems yielding to Christ is not very safe after all.
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
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RE: Rebellion against god
February 27, 2018 at 5:40 pm
Quote:If the universe and everything in it is God's creation, then all of it is proof, but if a person was to deny that, then there isn't any proof to be had.
To bad it's not proof . I do reject said claim . Yes their is i we have stated it.
Quote:Some people argue that some sort of show would convince them.
Let's say that they are convinced by a sensory and scientifically documented experience , then what?
Will it be idolatry again?
If a true god reveal itself people would believe in it and it alone on that proof .
Quote:The rebellion is still there.
Proof that the rebellion will not leave upon revelation, is this - the law of God requires obedience to God on all levels. Will people give up their sins?
No they won't
.If a true god reveal itself people would have no motivation need or want to rebel .
Quote:God will show his face to those who love and obey him.
then your god is not a real god
Quote:I'm just wondering what sin people think is too precious to give up?
You call it a sin i call integrity, intelligence, and reason the highest possible virtue . And i will not give them up . No matter how much you ilk demonize them as sins . Because their virtues your ideology lacks .
Seek strength, not to be greater than my brother, but to fight my greatest enemy -- myself.
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RE: Rebellion against god
February 27, 2018 at 6:36 pm
(This post was last modified: February 27, 2018 at 6:37 pm by drfuzzy.)
(February 27, 2018 at 4:07 pm)Banned Wrote: (February 25, 2018 at 10:34 am)Fake Messiah Wrote:
If you read the texts properly you would see that the method of being saved is predestinated, not whether someone will be saved or not.
(February 25, 2018 at 11:13 am)Joods Wrote:
Quote:If everything that exists was proof that God made and owns the universe
it has not been established at all that nature proves the existence of a deity. Quite the opposite,
Quote:in fact. , then why should God put on a Muppet show for those that would hate hiim regardless?
"Muppet show" you like that term. You have used it before with the appropriate level of scorn. But a "Muppet show" with a deity that actually showed UP and proved that it's not a fantasy would be orders of magnitude greater than the absurd snake-oil salesman lying witch doctor shows that happen in churches every weekend. It would be proof! That's obvious.
Quote:And no, Christains are not oblidged to have anything to do with those who reject them and their message. They are to inform people and leave an example of acceptance and respect.
Jesus said that it will be more tolerable for the people of Sodom and Gomorrah than for the generation that mocks God having had the opportunity to know Christ.
Accept what I say without any proof or burn. Oh yes, that's love for you.
Quote:Your rejection of the Bible has nothing to do with its veracity.
We reject it because nobody can prove that it has any value.
Quote:The means of connection to God are not through a shining conveyor belt, but by your mind, which he respects and leaves alone until you give him permission to connect with you.
People will allow a drug to take over their minds, but they won't allow God to comminicate to them, even though he will never harm or manipulate them.
Oh isn't that convenient. Connection to god is ONLY possible through unprovable, unmeasurable, unverifiable flights of fancy. You keep making the same assertions over and over, even after being told that we reject them. Your delusions aren't going to suddenly come true after the thousandth repetition. The era of "believe my stories or burn" is over.
Predestination. Yep. If your imaginary friend MADE the universe, and is actually omniscient, omnipotent, and omnipresent, (yes, I know the sky-daddy is a huge stretch and the fantasy capabilities attributed to it are . . . WAY beyond logical, but IF) then it knew, before the Big Bang, that it would create humans. And the humans would sin. And it would create hell. And it would drop 99% of every human ever born in the last 5 million years in hell for all eternity, and a few of it's sycophants would cheer over the screams of all of those poor souls who were being eternally tortured. Yep. What a lovely imaginary demon you worship. And yes, I have read many apologetic hoops that people who believe predestination is a thing go through trying to explain WHY it's not evil. They're truly sick.
Yammer yammer yammer, the same old "god will get you after you die", "you'll find out at the judgment", "why do you hate god?" "what sin are you clinging to that you won't listen to the voice of god?" idiocy, over and over and over and over and over and over and over --
PROVE YOUR SKY DADDY EXISTS. You can blubber all you want about your imaginary friend, but it's all completely moot until you can prove it exists. And that's only going to happen when you get it to show up and say "hi". In person. No telepathic delusions or warm fuzzy feelings.
Until it shows up, all of that "connection to God" sounds like "why won't you say the prayer so you can feel the love of the Celestial Pink Unicorn? Why won't you accept the Celestial Pink Unicorn into your heart and life?"
What an astounding bunch of bullshit.
"The family that prays together...is brainwashing their children."- Albert Einstein
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RE: Rebellion against god
February 27, 2018 at 7:06 pm
(February 27, 2018 at 4:07 pm)Banned Wrote: If everything that exists was proof that God made and owns the universe, then why should God put on a Muppet show for those that would hate hiim regardless?
If he's not willing to show his face and is 100% dependent on humans to spread "his message" then why should I waste time on such an entity who can't even provide proof of his "work"? Seeing is believing you know. If I can't see him, I sure as hell am not going to believe him.
Quote:And no, Christains are not oblidged to have anything to do with those who reject them and their message.
Then do us all a favor and don't let the door hit you on the way out. Clearly there's nothing for you here but a bunch of non-believers who adamantly reject your god and its message.
Quote:They are to inform people and leave an example of acceptance and respect.
Totally opposite of what your god is all about. Non-believers are better examples of acceptance and respect. We let you in here, after all. Look at all the religious forums that immediately ban an atheist (or any other person) the moment said person doesn't agree with the religious and their ideals. Can't say we do that here. We have many theists who have been a part of these forums for YEARS.
Quote:Your rejection of the Bible has nothing to do with its veracity.
Yes it does. The lack of proof and evidence is exactly why I reject it and the nonsense it contains. Lack of accuracy is why I reject it. The simple fact that the first two chapters of Genesis directly contradict each other are reason enough to reject it. The bible has NO veracity because you can't verify any of the information contained in it, via a measurable or proven method.
Quote:The means of connection to God are not through a shining conveyor belt, but by your mind, which he respects and leaves alone until you give him permission to connect with you.
People will allow a drug to take over their minds, but they won't allow God to comminicate to them, even though he will never harm or manipulate them.
Does the flood ring a bell?
Genocide?
How about what he cursed Eve with after some fucking talking snake convinced her to eat an apple that she promptly gave to Adam.
How come there are no talking snakes in the present day?
Your bible and your god are made up. Nice try though.
Disclaimer: I am only responsible for what I say, not what you choose to understand.
(November 14, 2018 at 8:57 pm)The Valkyrie Wrote: Have a good day at work. If we ever meet in a professional setting, let me answer your question now. Yes, I DO want fries with that.
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RE: Rebellion against god
February 27, 2018 at 7:13 pm
(February 27, 2018 at 5:07 pm)Banned Wrote: If the universe and everything in it is God's creation, then all of it is proof, but if a person was to deny that, then there isn't any proof to be had.
Correct. There is as of yet no actual proof to be had. At this point all you have is your belief, which you are trying to leverage against reality to support that belief. That's a circular argument, and logically invalid.
Quote:The rebellion is still there.
Proof that the rebellion will not leave upon revelation, is this - the law of God requires obedience to God on all levels. Will people give up their sins?
No they won't.
There is no actual rebellion, as one cannot "rebel" against a fictional being.
Obey the laws of your church if you wish. I will not. I have no patience or respect at all for cults that preach end-times theology.
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RE: Rebellion against god
February 27, 2018 at 7:25 pm
Dr. Fuzzy - you might want to fix your quote tags while there's still time to edit your post.
Disclaimer: I am only responsible for what I say, not what you choose to understand.
(November 14, 2018 at 8:57 pm)The Valkyrie Wrote: Have a good day at work. If we ever meet in a professional setting, let me answer your question now. Yes, I DO want fries with that.
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RE: Rebellion against god
February 27, 2018 at 10:25 pm
(This post was last modified: February 27, 2018 at 10:30 pm by LadyForCamus.)
(February 27, 2018 at 3:41 pm)Banned Wrote: (February 25, 2018 at 10:27 am)LadyForCamus Wrote: This is circular reasoning:..
Once you have built a strong and convincing case for god as well as intelligent design, then you can work on building a case for the existence of heaven. I’ll wait. 😏
Firstly, you don't believe that God exists or that he rewards those who diligently seek him, or that the Bible is the means that God has chosen to educate believers and prepare them for eternal life.
Correct. I do not believe these claims. Noone has ever given me a reason to.
Quote:Until you yield to God, you will not have the capacity to see the evidence, even though the universe and everything in it was created by God.
How can I yield to something that I don’t believe exists? Why would you even say that to me if you know I’m not convinced that god exists in the first place? Why should I care what anyone has to say about a thing that I don’t even believe is real? Would you care to hear me yammer on about the details of the invisible, fire-breathing dragon in my garage if I don’t provide you with any evidence or reason to believe it exists at all?
Quote:The reason people avaoid the knowledge of God is because they know that they will have to give up their idols. They cannot see reconciliation happening.
So, rather than ask me why I don’t believe, you’re just going to assume your own reasons (or whatever your cult tells you is the real reason) and project them onto me? Talking to you is like talking to a robot. Did they give you a script?
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”
Wiser words were never spoken.
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