(July 17, 2018 at 6:00 pm)RoadRunner79 Wrote: I admit, I made up the thing about toasters, so I’m guessing it’s probably a low percentage of the population that seeks that level of toaster commitment.  But nothing surprises me anymore. And this has nothing to do with what you imagine as bigotry.  The question is why do you find it idiotic?  Do you find the arguments bad, or are you just a hateful bigot when it comes to toasty appliances. Doesn’t everyone deserve equal rights?

You do not see the faulty logic in comparing a human-appliance relationship with a human-human relationship?

It is as absurd as thinking that legalizing human-human homosexual marriage will lead to the legalization of a human-goat marriage.

(July 17, 2018 at 6:05 pm)Kit Wrote: You do not see the faulty logic in comparing a human-appliance relationship with a human-human relationship?

It is as absurd as thinking that legalizing human-human homosexual marriage will lead to a human-goat relationship.

Christianity is far more likely to lead to that one tbh.

(July 17, 2018 at 6:00 pm)RoadRunner79 Wrote:

(July 17, 2018 at 5:36 pm)The Gentleman Bastard Wrote: RR, if you want to marry yourself, by all means, knock yourself out. Your augment aboit toasters though, is just idiocy. Of course, it's what we've come to expect from theists hiding bigotry behind the thin veil of religious belief. Not what I really expected from you, but still less than a surprise.

I admit, I made up the thing about toasters, so I’m guessing it’s probably a low percentage of the population that seeks that level of toaster commitment. But nothing surprises me anymore. And this has nothing to do with what you imagine as bigotry. The question is why do you find it idiotic? Do you find the arguments bad, or are you just a hateful bigot when it comes to toasty appliances. Doesn’t everyone deserve equal rights?

Since you want to double down on your idiocy, I'll respond with an absurdity...

If you wish to stick your dick in a toaster, who am I to stop you. You just better hope your blender doesn't get jealous. An over voltage from the blender to the toaster at the wrong moment could be a shocking experience for you.

(July 17, 2018 at 6:05 pm)Kit Wrote:

(July 17, 2018 at 6:00 pm)RoadRunner79 Wrote: I admit, I made up the thing about toasters, so I’m guessing it’s probably a low percentage of the population that seeks that level of toaster commitment.  But nothing surprises me anymore. And this has nothing to do with what you imagine as bigotry.  The question is why do you find it idiotic?  Do you find the arguments bad, or are you just a hateful bigot when it comes to toasty appliances. Doesn’t everyone deserve equal rights?

You do not see the faulty logic in comparing a human-appliance relationship with a human-human relationship?

I could see where one might claim there is a category error there; if they are a knuckle dragging regressive.  For progressives however; we just re-define the term, in the name of equality.  If it's not equal, then you must be discriminating and therefore hateful.    Equal protection under the law apparently means this.  Also, we should probably talk about participation trophies for everyone who attends the ceremony.  

Quote:It is as absurd as thinking that legalizing human-human homosexual marriage will lead to the legalization of a human-goat marriage.

We probably haven't "progressed" to that point yet.  But perhaps one day they will be viewed as the same.  You probably just feel this way, because you find human-goat marriage icky!  Just because they are not the same, doesn't mean that they are not equal.

I think we broke RR. :C

(July 17, 2018 at 12:47 pm)RoadRunner79 Wrote: Seems like we should just call everyone married, and then no one is discriminated against.  I'll be a married bachelor, or someone can marry their toaster.   Whatever floats your boat I suppose.

The first is essentially the same as the government getting out of the marriage business.

So do we now get tax deductions?

The second is idiocy. Toasters, at least currently, cannot enter into legal contracts. If, in the future, they have enough self-awareness to do so and you wish to marry your toaster (and the toaster agrees), then go for it. But, as yet, toasters don't seem to be asking for marriage rights. And you don't get to marry without an agreement.

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(July 17, 2018 at 7:45 pm)RoadRunner79 Wrote:

(July 17, 2018 at 6:05 pm)Kit Wrote: You do not see the faulty logic in comparing a human-appliance relationship with a human-human relationship?

I could see where one might claim there is a category error there; if they are a knuckle dragging regressive.  For progressives however; we just re-define the term, in the name of equality.  If it's not equal, then you must be discriminating and therefore hateful.    Equal protection under the law apparently means this.  Also, we should probably talk about participation trophies for everyone who attends the ceremony.  

Quote:It is as absurd as thinking that legalizing human-human homosexual marriage will lead to the legalization of a human-goat marriage.

We probably haven't "progressed" to that point yet.  But perhaps one day they will be viewed as the same.  You probably just feel this way, because you find human-goat marriage icky!  Just because they are not the same, doesn't mean that they are not equal.

Thanks for comparing gays to toasters and goats. The continuing bigotry is noted.

Again, goats cannot enter into legal contracts.  They do not show the awareness and understanding to be able to agree to a  valid contract.

So, the fact that you see this as a slippery slope to such just shows how far away from being moral you really are.

You know, I think we really upset Roadrunner. I'm now thinking he probably has sex with his toaster, and actually wants to marry it.

So we have reached this desperate tactic have we 

So now were he's comparing a relationship between two humans to a relationship with a non sentient things and making gay marriage into essentially a fetish Yup he's hit bigot rock bottom .

(July 17, 2018 at 8:10 pm)polymath257 Wrote:

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(July 17, 2018 at 12:47 pm)RoadRunner79 Wrote: Seems like we should just call everyone married, and then no one is discriminated against.  I'll be a married bachelor, or someone can marry their toaster.   Whatever floats your boat I suppose.

The first is essentially the same as the government getting out of the marriage business.

So do we now get tax deductions?

The second is idiocy. Toasters, at least currently, cannot enter into legal contracts. If, in the future, they have enough self-awareness to do so and you wish to marry your toaster (and the toaster agrees), then go for it. But, as yet, toasters don't seem to be asking for marriage rights. And you don't get to marry without an agreement.

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(July 17, 2018 at 7:45 pm)RoadRunner79 Wrote: I could see where one might claim there is a category error there; if they are a knuckle dragging regressive.  For progressives however; we just re-define the term, in the name of equality.  If it's not equal, then you must be discriminating and therefore hateful.    Equal protection under the law apparently means this.  Also, we should probably talk about participation trophies for everyone who attends the ceremony.  


We probably haven't "progressed" to that point yet.  But perhaps one day they will be viewed as the same.  You probably just feel this way, because you find human-goat marriage icky!  Just because they are not the same, doesn't mean that they are not equal.

Thanks for comparing gays to toasters and goats. The continuing bigotry is noted.

Again, goats cannot enter into legal contracts.  They do not show the awareness and understanding to be able to agree to a  valid contract.

So, the fact that you see this as a slippery slope to such just shows how far away from being moral you really are.

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• I'm not comparing a same sex attracted person with a toaster.  Not even close.  Bigotry redacted!
  

This isn't so much a slippery slope argument, but more of an argument to absurdity.   I think it is right to reject these arguments (as it seems do others).  It's not about discrimination to say that marriage doesn't apply to goats or to toasters.  We wouldn't be hating this person, or denying them rights to say that they can't get married, because it is not within the definition of marriage.  And we shoudn't be expected to change that definition in the name of equality.  A marriage is not between a human and a goat or a toaster.  It simply doesn't qualify.  And even worse, a married bachelor is incoherent.  We shouldn't change the definition to allow this, while the same word may be used, it wouldn't be equal, because we are not talking about the same thing anymore (not even close).  When people use to say that rights where being denied, and this is horrible, I would ask as a single person, what rights I didn't have.

This wasn't an argument against same sex unions either. It doesn't show what marriage is or should be.   It wasn't a slippery slope that if you allow this, you must allow these other things (I didn't plan on people agreeing with me).  But I think that it does show that it is not "equality" no matter what.  That marriage is defined, and if you fall outside of that definition, it doesn't make you any less of a person (no more than me being single means I have less rights or am less human than a married person).  Equality in regards to rights and equal protection under the law doesn't mean that we can do whatever we want, or redefine a word, because we want to be a part of something.  I can't just call myself a "Doctor" because I don't qualify.  it's not oppressive.  For a Christian, marriage isn't just a legal or social contract (it's kind of sad, if that is all it is for others).  It is sacred, a gift from God.  It is the union between one man and one woman, two becoming one.  It was set out that way from the beginning. 

We may have disagreements on what marriage is, and who qualifies.  But it is not about hate, or intolerance, or fear.  It's not about denying rights or saying that someone is less human. Not for myself anyway.  I was being facetious, and perhaps that was wrong and insensitive. But for the Christian's here or anyone who holds to marriage as being between a man and women, we couldn't say anything, without being shouted down and slandered (even some personal attacks). So while we may not arrive at the same conclusion; perhaps, people may be a little more tolerant of other views; and realize that we do hold to a definition of marriage, which will necessarily exclude from (we won't even get into marrying cousins). From the point of view of the state, I actually think it is about the states interest in promoting marriage and who that applies to. The whole rights thing is just a smoke screen.

Quote:I could see where one might claim there is a category error there; if they are a knuckle dragging regressive.  For progressives however; we just re-define the term, in the name of equality.  If it's not equal, then you must be discriminating and therefore hateful.    Equal protection under the law apparently means this.  Also, we should probably talk about participation trophies for everyone who attends the ceremony.   

So many straw men 

Yup we broke him 

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Quote:This isn't so much a slippery slope argument, but more of an argument to absurdity.   I think it is right to reject these arguments (as it seems do others).  It's not about discrimination to say that marriage doesn't apply to goats or to toasters.  We wouldn't be hating this person, or denying them rights to say that they can't get married, because it is not within the definition of marriage.  And we shoudn't be expected to change that definition in the name of equality.  A marriage is not between a human and a goat or a toaster.  It simply doesn't qualify.  And even worse, a married bachelor is incoherent.  We shouldn't change the definition to allow this, while the same word may be used, it wouldn't be equal, because we are not talking about the same thing anymore (not even close).  When people use to say that rights where being denied, and this is horrible, I would ask as a single person, what rights I didn't have.

This wasn't an argument against same sex unions either. It doesn't show what marriage is or should be.   It wasn't a slippery slope that if you allow this, you must allow these other things (I didn't plan on people agreeing with me).  But I think that it does show that it is not "equality" no matter what.  That marriage is defined, and if you fall outside of that definition, it doesn't make you any less of a person (no more than me being single means I have less rights or am less human than a married person).  Equality in regards to rights and equal protection under the law doesn't mean that we can do whatever we want, or redefine a word, because we want to be a part of something.  I can't just call myself a "Doctor" because I don't qualify.  it's not oppressive.  For a Christian, marriage isn't just a legal or social contract (it's kind of sad, if that is all it is for others).  It is sacred, a gift from God.  It is the union between one man and one woman, two becoming one.  It was set out that way from the beginning.  

We may have disagreements on what marriage is, and who qualifies.  But it is not about hate, or intolerance, or fear.  It's not about denying rights or saying that someone is less human. Not for myself anyway.  I was being facetious, and perhaps that was wrong and insensitive. But for the Christian's here or anyone who holds to marriage as being between a man and women, we couldn't say anything, without being shouted down and slandered (even some personal attacks). So while we may not arrive at the same conclusion; perhaps, people may be a little more tolerant of other views; and realize that we do hold to a definition of marriage, which will necessarily exclude from (we won't even get into marrying cousins). From the point of view of the state, I actually think it is about the states interest in promoting marriage and who that applies to. The whole rights thing is just a smoke screen.

Too bad this long creed  is none sense 

1. Gays do qualify for marriage in a way you idiotic comparisons do not 

2. Christian views of marriage are regressive and hateful 

3.We can change definition for equality and you comparison to a doctor is dumb 

4. No one cares what Christians call marriage 

5.Marriage is a legal contract  no matter what Christians say and yes it's bigoted

6.There is no disagreement you side is bigoted

7.The rest is just Boo Hoo victimhood  for being called out 

8. No we don't have tolerate regressive views (and their are reasons we don't allow incest so fail)

9. Yes just literally compared gay marriage to marrying a goat

10. No we must not let "other things" we can stop at gay marriage without contradiction .

This was a long ranty waste of time

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Quote:Three points: 1) You do realize you had to use modifiers to distinguish your remote exceptions to the traditional definition of marriage, right? 2) these variations are between men and women. 3) What do you think the % of these outliers are to the billions and billions of traditional marriage? How many decimal points do you think you need?

The fact there are variations kills you whole point no matter what percentage they are  

Quote:You have your head in the sand if you don't think marriage is the single most important institution in the history of civilization.

It's not and it's never been