Using the Quran to prove Islam is the same as using "The Deathly Hallows" to prove Harry Potter.
You must use EXTERNAL references, or your argument is circular.

Islam is just like every other religion.
The only reason we even know about it, is because of the political advantage it conferred on its adherents.
It unified a far-flung empire.
It worked for Alexander. It worked for Artaxexes, (when he sent some Israelites back with what became the Torah of Moses).
It worked for Constantine, and it worked for the Arabs.
You can't even prove that Muhammad was real.

Jo - The name of God is defined through out Quran, the thing about the name of God is that he named himself with it, so he defines it, it's terms, and it's reality, and exactly what it is and how to recognize it and how it points to God.

That was the only thing I thought was worthy of clarifying with your post.

(November 16, 2018 at 1:01 pm)Kit Wrote:

(November 16, 2018 at 12:51 pm)Jörmungandr Wrote:

Who's that cutie?

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(November 16, 2018 at 1:14 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: Jo - The name of God is defined through out Quran, the thing about the name of God is that he named himself with it, so he defines it, it's terms, and it's reality, and exactly what it is and how to recognize it and how it points to God.

That was the only thing I thought was worthy of clarifying with your post.

Since you haven't given us a hint as to what that means so far, you might as well be talking in a foreign language. How are we supposed to make sense of arguments composed of nothing but gibberish?

You wait to see what the whole book reveals regarding it, which I will be showing. Otherwise your impatience is not my problem nor your hastiness to refute and argue, and not listen my fault.

It has nothing to do with impatience, silly.

We'll wait while you continue to post and see that we waited for nothing.

(November 16, 2018 at 1:43 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: You wait to see what the whole book reveals regarding it, which I will be showing.  Otherwise your impatience is not my problem nor your hastiness to refute and argue, and not listen my fault.

But whether we can make sense of the terms you are using is your problem. If you're just gonna spew word salad that doesn't mean dick to us, you should probably just go fuck yourself.

(November 16, 2018 at 1:43 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: You wait to see what the whole book reveals regarding it, which I will be showing.  Otherwise your impatience is not my problem nor your hastiness to refute and argue, and not listen my fault.

I admire your diligence in acting like a total fucking retard every day.  You have the whole act down pat.

I also do not think it is a great career path.

Terms to understanding Quran

If a book is to be a guidance from God regarding all matters that pertain to guidance,  it needs us to reflect to perceive guidance we need. Any reflection is good, but what is not good is relying on conjecture or relying that which is unclear from Quran as opposed to clear signs and bright insights it provides.

A book filled of parables:

Surely God is not ashamed to set forth any parable-- (that of) a gnat or any thing above that; then as for those who believe, they know that it is the truth from their Lord, and as for those who disbelieve, they say: What is it that God means by this parable: He causes many to err by it and many He leads aright by it! but He does not cause to err by it (any) except the transgressors. (2:26)

Parables are a useful utility to convey to make people understand. Those who believe will know exactly what God meant by the parable and be guided by it. Those who disbelieve, due to the fact, understanding would lead to faith and guidance, will instead argue or not perceive and say "what is that God means by this parable?".

The name of God is a parable at the end because God can't be limited by a language term for a name.  Those who believe will know it's the truth from their Lord, as they do when God strikes other parables.

The transgressors are the only people who the parables just confuses them more and they become more misguided due to them.

Who break the covenant of God after its confirmation and cut asunder what God has ordered to be joined, and make mischief in the land; these it is that are the losers. (2:27)

Following what is unclear from the book:

He it is Who has revealed the Book to you; from it are clear signs, they are the mother of the Book, and from it is unclearness, then as for those in whose hearts there is perversity they follow what is unclear from it, seeking it's trial and seeking to give it (their own) interpretation. but none knows its interpretation except God; As well those who are firmly rooted in knowledge, they say: We believe in it, it is all from our Lord; and no one remembers except those having understanding.


From Quran come clear signs, they are the original and of the true book revealed to Mohammad and the clear signs are in accordance to insights provided to him and that the provides to others. 

From it will also come unclearness, things that are unclear by language to mean something but people hold on to the unclarity from it as if clear. These people are building the Quran per their interpretation and are imposing their opinion on Quran.  They act like they know the Quran and it's interpretation, while, no one really fully understands even one verse from Quran, but God and those who are firmly rooted in knowledge.  (3:7)

The Surah then reminds of the past chosen families who were the rope from God and rope from humans, as the rope of God, that were coupled with the revelations revealed by God.

The Prophet was to clarify Quran and so were the family of the reminder:


And We did not send before you any but men to whom we revealed to-- so ask the family of the Reminder if you do not know.
With clear arguments and scriptures; and We have revealed to you the Reminder that you may make clear to men what has been revealed to them, and that they may reflect.(16:43-44)


Unclearness from Quran was not meant to be unclear, but rather, we are supposed to seek clarification. In the words of Imam Ali though: "it's darkness cannot be illuminated save through itself."

The hadiths in this regard, are meant to help us uncover what is in Quran and what the Quran itself confirms. As hadiths maybe true or false, fabricated or truly said by one of God's trusted interpreters, we are to refer them back to Quran.

The hadiths in this regard are many, as well, that all hadiths are to be referred back to Quran, and what Quran confirms is true and what it doesn't or rejects is false.

The mistake of Muslims in this regard was underestimating Quran. We will show, however, that the rituals, their details, etc, all is found in Quran, and where the Sunnah is explicit, the Quran compliments implicitly, and where the Quran is explicit, the Sunnah compliments the interior of it.

A sign that Quran is from God, is this nature of it.  Those who build their foundations on only what is clear, will find it continuously unraveling wonders. While those who due to their injustice, hold on to what is unclear, will be destroyed by it and in it's own words it will increase them in nothing but perdition.

You have learned absolutely NOTHING from our previous conversation. Same thing over and over, expecting different results, and all that Jazz.

(November 17, 2018 at 12:28 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote: You have learned absolutely NOTHING from our previous conversation.  Same thing over and over, expecting different results, and all that Jazz.

You have to understand some degree of the Quran if you are going to perceive any miraculous aspects of it.   We are just building some of those blocks, Surah means build or form or structure.

But to see that structure, you have to see it's place in Quran. And to see the place of it's signs and proofs in it, you have to see it's flow in the Surah. And so to really see any of the "signs" of God in the Quran, you have to see the Quran over all, not understand every minute detail, but begin to see it's structure and form.

I am just building. All I ask you is to persevere, remain patient, and reflect.  If any of what I say so far is unclear, as for clarification, and I will try my best to clarify.