(July 27, 2021 at 10:37 pm)Huggy Bear Wrote:

(July 27, 2021 at 10:24 pm)Paleophyte Wrote: No, we're talking about slavery. Read the book. The people getting bought, sold, inherited, captured in war, sexually molested, beaten, and killed are not simply debtors. If a debtor is gored by an ox it isn't the bank that gets paid 30 shekels of silver. Ironic that number.

Servants HAD to be given thier freedom on jubilee no ifs ands or butts. Therefore they had a right to thier freedom after a certain amount of time. Slaves in America had ZERO have rights, they were slaves in perpetuity. So no we're NOT talking about slavery.  I like how you guys keep dishonestly trying to frame it as such aka grasping at straws...🤣

That applied only to jewish slaves, and if you timed it correctly they would be your property for 50 years. Even more, magic book explained a trick how to make them (jews) your permanent property which you could pass down to your children.
On top of that, having servants is and was immoral too. Asking if slavery and serfdom is a disgustign attempt to deflect from an ugly truth of your religion to a only somewhat less ugly truth. It shows how much religion has poisoned you rmoral compass. It amost points straight south.

You havent read those passages about slavery, jublee and trcking fellow jews into permanent slavery in your holy book, have you? Try it.

Would you like to be my slave or servant, according to the rules of the bible?
Yes or no

Like Nudger said: You gave up your humanity for a book of immoralities, and arent even embarassed to parade around within this forum.

(July 28, 2021 at 3:19 am)Deesse23 Wrote:

(July 27, 2021 at 10:37 pm)Huggy Bear Wrote: Servants HAD to be given thier freedom on jubilee no ifs ands or butts. Therefore they had a right to thier freedom after a certain amount of time. Slaves in America had ZERO have rights, they were slaves in perpetuity. So no we're NOT talking about slavery.  I like how you guys keep dishonestly trying to frame it as such aka grasping at straws...🤣

That applied only to jewish slaves, and if you timed it correctly they would be your property for 50 years.

10 And ye shall hallow the fiftieth year, and proclaim liberty throughout all the land unto all the inhabitants thereof: it shall be a jubile unto you; and ye shall return every man unto his possession, and ye shall return every man unto his family.

Where does it state only Jews in the above quote? If there is no qualifier than ALL and EVERY mean just exactly that.

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dict...nglish/all
all
determiner, predeterminer, pronoun
every one (of), or the complete amount or number (of), or the whole (of):

every
determiner
used when referring to all the members of a group of three or more:

(July 28, 2021 at 3:19 am)Deesse23 Wrote: Even more, magic book explained a trick how to make them (jews) your permanent property which you could pass down to your children.
On top of that, having servants is and was immoral too. Asking if slavery and serfdom is a disgustign attempt to deflect from an ugly truth of your religion to a only somewhat less ugly truth. It shows how much religion has poisoned you rmoral compass. It amost points straight south.

You havent read those passages about slavery, jublee and trcking fellow jews into permanent slavery in your holy book, have you? Try it.

Would you like to be my slave or servant, according to the rules of the bible?
Yes or no

Like Nudger said: You gave up your humanity for a book of immoralities, and arent even embarassed to parade around within this forum.

Look, I've debated this topic long before you joined this forum against people that were a lot smarter than you, you're not going to fare any better.

This jackass is giving us the definition of all as though it mattered.

Jubilee isn’t what you thought it was, sorry, I guess? It was a method by which land and property, including human beings, was kept and consolidated within families of original affluence. I’ve never seen someone so committed to slavery who didn’t wish to own slaves themselves.

Disgusting position, incompetent arguments.

(July 28, 2021 at 3:56 am)Huggy Bear Wrote: Look, I've debated this topic long before you joined this forum against people that were a lot smarter than you, you're not going to fare any better.

...and you didnt learn a thing?! Again, parading around your ignorance, not very impressive.
Empty words, utterly unimpressive.
Your condescension, utterly unimpressive
Actual arguments, that would be impressive.

Consider: “You shall not give up to his master a slave who has escaped from his master to you. He shall dwell with you, in your midst, in the place that he shall choose within one of your towns, wherever it suits him. You shall not wrong him" (Deuteronomy 23:15, ESV).

In contrast with the United States Constitution, Article IV: "No person held to service or labor in one state, under the laws thereof, escaping into another, shall, in consequence of any law or regulation therein, be discharged from such service or labor, but shall be delivered up on claim of the party to whom such service or labor may be due.”

(July 28, 2021 at 6:31 am)The Grand Nudger Wrote: This jackass is giving us the definition of all as though it mattered.

Jubilee isn’t what you thought it was, sorry, I guess?  It was a method by which land and property, including human beings, was kept and consolidated within families of original affluence. I’ve never seen someone so committed to slavery who didn’t wish to own slaves themselves.

Disgusting position, incompetent arguments.

Genesis 29
18 And Jacob loved Rachel; and said, I will serve thee seven years for Rachel thy younger daughter.
19 And Laban said, It is better that I give her to thee, than that I should give her to another man: abide with me.
20 And Jacob served seven years for Rachel; and they seemed unto him but a few days, for the love he had to her.

If indentured servitude was so disgusting or inhumane, why would anyone volunteer to do it?

Y'all are straight clowns.

Only applied to Israelites, and both are examples from world views which we now consider insufficient, or worse.

What do you think John? Would you like to contend that Christianity isn’t supportive of slavery…or would you prefer to imply, instead, that it is….but that’s nbd, since some other slaving state did the same?

I’ll point out the irony in the comparison. The second society was greatly informed by the first with regards to the propriety of slavery.

---

Idk Huggy, why -would- anyone become an indentured servant, or a serf, or a slave? Seems like there might be plenty of historic and contemporary examples that might answer the question.

What’s the point of advocating for the exploitation of labor? How does it profit Christianity in any way? What…exactly….do you imagine yourself to have been doing in this thread?

(July 28, 2021 at 11:31 am)The Grand Nudger Wrote: Only applied to Israelites, and both are examples from world views which we now consider insufficient, or worse.

No; read any commentary on the verse. The verse is referring almost exclusively to foreigners, hence why they were to be given refuge in any town within Israel. Notice also that it echoes other verses with similar instructions: "When a foreigner resides among you in your land, do not mistreat them" (Leviticus 19:33, NIV).

Only….applied…to Israelites. They were talking about repatriation from the diaspora.

Their society was an explicit ethnostate by divine command. Foreigners, as in non tribesman ( they could actually be locals- remember- the society believed that the land had been given to them) …had little to no rights, and were the main supply of slave labor to the culture in question.

Islam would emulate this system centuries later( and at least for a time, Christianity did the same)

You might also enjoy reading from the later prophets of old magic book, complaining that their society failed to abide by even those minimal and horrendous laws.

I can’t be any more direct than to point out arguments to the contrary aren’t a difference of opinion or a matter of belief- they’re straight lunatic shit. Historic, contemporary secular and contemporary rabbinical sources are all in explicit agreement over the state of human liberty in the ot ane.

(July 28, 2021 at 11:28 am)Huggy Bear Wrote:

(July 28, 2021 at 6:31 am)The Grand Nudger Wrote: This jackass is giving us the definition of all as though it mattered.

Jubilee isn’t what you thought it was, sorry, I guess?  It was a method by which land and property, including human beings, was kept and consolidated within families of original affluence. I’ve never seen someone so committed to slavery who didn’t wish to own slaves themselves.

Disgusting position, incompetent arguments.

Genesis 29
18 And Jacob loved Rachel; and said, I will serve thee seven years for Rachel thy younger daughter.
19 And Laban said, It is better that I give her to thee, than that I should give her to another man: abide with me.
20 And Jacob served seven years for Rachel; and they seemed unto him but a few days, for the love he had to her.

If indentured servitude was so disgusting or inhumane, why would anyone volunteer to do it?

Y'all are straight clowns.

[emphasis mine]

The exception proves the rule.  The fact that he has to mention that his servitude was easily endured implies that typically servitude is something that is hard to endure.