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RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
July 10, 2023 at 7:41 pm
(This post was last modified: July 10, 2023 at 7:42 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
-and yet there's nothing specifically illogical with believing in any of the three. Whether gods exist and whether afterlives exist are wholly separate questions and any number of combinations are both logically possible and historically evident.
It takes more...much more than theism to get where you're at. Each step of the way adds a new opportunity for you to fuck it up.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
July 10, 2023 at 7:43 pm
(July 10, 2023 at 7:36 pm)Angrboda Wrote: Yes, that you assert this doesn't make it the case.
Again, I never claimed that it is the case. Once again, zero understanding of logical implicaton.
P => Q being true doesn't entail that P is true.
"traditionally conceived God => afterlife" being true doesn't entail that traditionally conceived God is real.
(July 10, 2023 at 7:36 pm)Angrboda Wrote: God traditionally can't do anything that controverts his nature. His nature is necessarily mysterious to us, so you can't say what necessarily is or isn't contrary to his nature. Thank you for playing.
God traditionally is benevolent, and so benevolence is part of his nature. If such a being exists, an afterlife exists. It's really not difficult, nor does it imply that your worldview is false, don't overthink.
I don't agree that God as traditionally conceived is completely mysterious, e.g. that we know nothing about Him, because then we wouldn't know enough to consider Him worship-worthy.
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RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
July 10, 2023 at 7:44 pm
(This post was last modified: July 10, 2023 at 7:45 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
You think that because you think particular things about afterlives. And you think particular things about worth.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
July 10, 2023 at 7:45 pm
(July 10, 2023 at 6:57 pm)Loaded dice Wrote: No one is single in heaven, that's certainly true in the Islamic account of heaven. All women in heaven definitely have a male partner or husband.
Islamic heaven is off my to-do list, then. I've had a male partner. I've had a female one. I prefer being single, and I certainly don't want to be stuck in a relationship for fucking eternity.
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RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
July 10, 2023 at 7:45 pm
(July 10, 2023 at 7:41 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: -and yet there's nothing specifically illogical with believing in any of the three. Whether gods exist and whether afterlives exist are wholly separate questions and any number of combinations are both logically possible and historically evident.
It takes more...much more than theism to get where you're at. Each step of the way adds a new opportunity for you to fuck it up.
Again what people believed in historically is of zero importance.
Maybe all the combinations of God real/not real + afterlife real/not real are logically possible, but they're not provable, except the one I mentioned : God real => afterlife real.
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RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
July 10, 2023 at 7:46 pm
Riiiight, well, get to work on that, then?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
July 10, 2023 at 7:48 pm
(This post was last modified: July 10, 2023 at 7:49 pm by Angrboda.)
(July 10, 2023 at 7:43 pm)Loaded dice Wrote: (July 10, 2023 at 7:36 pm)Angrboda Wrote: Yes, that you assert this doesn't make it the case.
Again, I never claimed that it is the case. Once again, zero understanding of logical implicaton.
P => Q being true doesn't entail that P is true.
"traditionally conceived God => afterlife" being true doesn't entail that traditionally conceived God is real.
(July 10, 2023 at 7:36 pm)Angrboda Wrote: God traditionally can't do anything that controverts his nature. His nature is necessarily mysterious to us, so you can't say what necessarily is or isn't contrary to his nature. Thank you for playing.
God traditionally is benevolent, and so benevolence is part of his nature. If such a being exists, an afterlife exists. It's really not difficult, nor does it imply that your worldview is false, don't overthink.
I don't agree that God as traditionally conceived is completely mysterious, e.g. that we know nothing about Him, because then we wouldn't know enough to consider Him worship-worthy.
Things that simpletons believe are true that aren't are never very difficult for them. There have been plenty who have conceived of God as simply annihilating us upon death, which they see as the most benevolent act. It sounds like you're projecting, ala "If I were a benevolent God then I would do X" -- but you aren't a benevolent god and so your speculation is uninformative. And I didn't say that God's nature was completely mysterious. Learn to read.
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RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
July 10, 2023 at 7:49 pm
I don't have any proof that the Spoonful Assassin is in your home right now, BUT YOU HAVE TO BELIEVE!
"Never trust a fox. Looks like a dog, behaves like a cat."
~ Erin Hunter
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RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
July 10, 2023 at 7:55 pm
I momentarily forgot that the first post in this thread was yours, Loaded. You're a moron of the first order so arguing with you is a waste of time. It would be better spent teaching the cat to sing.
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RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
July 10, 2023 at 7:58 pm
(July 10, 2023 at 7:45 pm)Astreja Wrote: (July 10, 2023 at 6:57 pm)Loaded dice Wrote: No one is single in heaven, that's certainly true in the Islamic account of heaven. All women in heaven definitely have a male partner or husband.
Islamic heaven is off my to-do list, then. I've had a male partner. I've had a female one. I prefer being single, and I certainly don't want to be stuck in a relationship for fucking eternity.
I don't think a relationship, or anything else in heaven, will be inconvenient. The very purpose of heaven is enjoyment. God will make it so that you necessarily enjoy whatever happens in heaven.
(July 10, 2023 at 7:48 pm)Angrboda Wrote: There have been plenty who have conceived of God as simply annihilating us upon death, which they see as the most benevolent act.
Plenty of people are morons who believe in moronic things, we know, thanks for the info. God annihilating both Hitler and his victims forever, with no justice served, is infinitely malevolent and evil. It radically contradicts benevolence. If you disagree with that, I am not sure you have the equipment to continue this conversation.
(July 10, 2023 at 7:48 pm)Angrboda Wrote: It sounds like you're projecting, ala "If I were a benevolent God then I would do X" -- but you aren't a benevolent god and so your speculation is uninformative.
I know what the word benevolent means and that's enough. We can understand properties without personally possessing these properties.
(July 10, 2023 at 7:48 pm)Angrboda Wrote: And I didn't say that God's nature was completely mysterious. Learn to read.
Right, you only said that God is mysterious. And by that you meant that God is only mildly, but not completely, mysterious. So we do know some things about God, as traditionally conceived, after all, huh ?
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