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RE: Theism and Western atheism are on the same continuum. Both are realist.
November 28, 2012 at 5:36 pm
(This post was last modified: November 28, 2012 at 5:37 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(November 28, 2012 at 5:33 pm)alwayson Wrote: Yes the onus is on you to back up your claim that the universe exists. .
Not really, I only have to ask if the person I'm discussing it with agrees. If they don't, I'm okay with that. Still, a rhetorical device is one thing, and again I was already aware of rhetorical devices..no buddhism required....explaining things or doing science is another..and again..no buddhism is required. It may not exist, and?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Theism and Western atheism are on the same continuum. Both are realist.
November 28, 2012 at 5:36 pm
The fact that you don't claim the Universe exists does not mean that everyone else is claiming that it does, unless they specifically say that. You are not going to be too popular if you keep behaving like this.
At the age of five, Skagra decided emphatically that God did not exist. This revelation tends to make most people in the universe who have it react in one of two ways - with relief or with despair. Only Skagra responded to it by thinking, 'Wait a second. That means there's a situation vacant.'
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RE: Theism and Western atheism are on the same continuum. Both are realist.
November 28, 2012 at 5:37 pm
(November 28, 2012 at 5:34 pm)Cthulhu Dreaming Wrote: (November 28, 2012 at 5:13 pm)alwayson Wrote: There is no Creation, [...]
Full stop. That's a positive claim. Yep, you've made no claim that the universe exists, on the contrary, you've made a positive, naked assertion that it doesn't.
Prove it.
See post 1.
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RE: Theism and Western atheism are on the same continuum. Both are realist.
November 28, 2012 at 5:37 pm
(This post was last modified: November 28, 2012 at 5:39 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Saw post 1, and a few others as well. You're entirely inconsistent with your own statements. That's the trouble with rhetorical devices btw....you can slip up and find yourself in the very position you hoped to ignore. The other problem being that most of them are fairly transparent.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Theism and Western atheism are on the same continuum. Both are realist.
November 28, 2012 at 5:38 pm
(November 28, 2012 at 5:36 pm)Stimbo Wrote: The fact that you don't claim the Universe exists does not mean that everyone else is claiming that it does, unless they specifically say that. You are not going to be too popular if you keep behaving like this.
They specifically asked for an explanation of the beginning of the universe.
That means they claim the universe exists.
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RE: Theism and Western atheism are on the same continuum. Both are realist.
November 28, 2012 at 5:38 pm
(November 28, 2012 at 5:37 pm)alwayson Wrote: (November 28, 2012 at 5:34 pm)Cthulhu Dreaming Wrote: Full stop. That's a positive claim. Yep, you've made no claim that the universe exists, on the contrary, you've made a positive, naked assertion that it doesn't.
Prove it.
See post 1.
Substantiate post 1.
At the age of five, Skagra decided emphatically that God did not exist. This revelation tends to make most people in the universe who have it react in one of two ways - with relief or with despair. Only Skagra responded to it by thinking, 'Wait a second. That means there's a situation vacant.'
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RE: Theism and Western atheism are on the same continuum. Both are realist.
November 28, 2012 at 5:39 pm
(November 28, 2012 at 5:38 pm)Stimbo Wrote: (November 28, 2012 at 5:37 pm)alwayson Wrote: See post 1.
Substantiate post 1.
Post 1 is a negation.
Madhyamaka does not put forth any philosophical positions.
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RE: Theism and Western atheism are on the same continuum. Both are realist.
November 28, 2012 at 5:40 pm
(November 28, 2012 at 5:37 pm)alwayson Wrote: (November 28, 2012 at 5:34 pm)Cthulhu Dreaming Wrote: Full stop. That's a positive claim. Yep, you've made no claim that the universe exists, on the contrary, you've made a positive, naked assertion that it doesn't.
Prove it.
See post 1.
Over/under 48 hours. Any takers?
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RE: Theism and Western atheism are on the same continuum. Both are realist.
November 28, 2012 at 5:40 pm
(This post was last modified: November 28, 2012 at 5:41 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Oh...it doesn't? lol, looked like you managed to put forth at least one....
(that you then proceeded to refuse to be consistent with)
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Theism and Western atheism are on the same continuum. Both are realist.
November 28, 2012 at 5:42 pm
(November 28, 2012 at 4:03 pm)alwayson Wrote: Theism and Western atheism are both based on the assumption that things exist. Thus both are on the same continuum of realism.
The following is a summary of Madhyamaka (which is a system of negation):
All philosophical and religious positions revolve around only 2 views: Existence and Nonexistence.
One cannot claim that anything exists, since for something to exist it would logically have to arise from a) itself b) other or c) both these possibilities together
Something cannot arise from itself, because that brings numerous contradictions. For example, arising would have to be part of its intrinsic nature, which would in turn lead to endless arisings.
Something cannot arise from other, because then you could have a giraffe spring from a rock. Anything could arise from anything. Moreover if an entity in itself does not exist, an entity other than it does not exist either.
Something cannot arise from both these possibilities together, because each one has been individually negated already.
All we are left with is illusion. Things only seem real because of imputed identities.
Reference: Center Of The Sunlit Sky by Karl Brunnholzl
6 pages wasted on something that the most anoying drunks will tell you, and you will usualy try to escape from.
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