(September 16, 2014 at 3:31 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote:

(September 16, 2014 at 3:28 pm)C4RM5 Wrote: My religion does not teach that I am useless, it actually teaches that I am valued that is why God offers everyone salvation. What it actually teaches is that without God i 'm going to suffer in Hell.

SO the only way to avoid getting tortured by God, is to worship him. You seriously don't see anything wrong with that?

Yea, I actually do see something wrong with that. By if God was being fair we would all be going to Hell. Instead God offers eternal lfe for nothing, so I praise and thank him everyday for it.

(September 16, 2014 at 3:34 pm)C4RM5 Wrote:

(September 16, 2014 at 3:31 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: SO the only way to avoid getting tortured by God, is to worship him. You seriously don't see anything wrong with that?

Yea, I actually do see something wrong with that. By if God was being fair we would all be going to Hell. Instead God offers eternal lfe for nothing, so I praise and thank him everyday for it.

No it's not for nothing. The only way you get that eternal life (supposedly) is by praising and worshipping him. Obviously you think I'm going to Hell, as I don't believe in God or his alter-ego Jesus. It's not free eternal life, it's conditional, it has a price.

(September 16, 2014 at 3:33 pm)ShaMan Wrote:

(September 16, 2014 at 3:24 pm)C4RM5 Wrote: I am extremely sorry if I offended you, I had no other way to put it. But if believe once you are truley saved will never lose your faith.

I'm not offended, I just thought I'd sent up a flag before things become unnecessarily messy. I honestly understand - I once would have said the same thing to someone who left the faith.

Consider this; I lived as a christian for many years, and I probably experienced many of the things which you are now experiencing. You, on the other hand, have never been where I am now, and therefore you have no way of legitimately addressing (or refuting) my current mindset.

My time as a christian was an extremely valuable education which lends itself daily to my every consideration. Take from that statement what you will.

It is true , I haven't experienced life without God as I was saved at a young age and have an extremely bad memory(For example I wouldn't be able to tell you what I had for dinner 2 nights ago)
I also never wanted to come on to this fourm and say "your wrong" all I wanted to do was give a Christian view on life.

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(September 16, 2014 at 3:35 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote:

(September 16, 2014 at 3:34 pm)C4RM5 Wrote: Yea, I actually do see something wrong with that. By if God was being fair we would all be going to Hell. Instead God offers eternal lfe for nothing, so I praise and thank him everyday for it.

No it's not for nothing. The only way you get that eternal life (supposedly) is by praising and worshipping him. Obviously you think I'm going to Hell, as I don't believe in God or his alter-ego Jesus. It's not free eternal life, it's conditional, it has a price.

It is not conditional, for instance I have heard people telling me that they never intended to be saved. But God spoke to them and they got saved and now they worship him.

(September 16, 2014 at 3:38 pm)C4RM5 Wrote: I also never wanted to come on to this fourm and say "your wrong" all I wanted to do was give a Christian view on life.

Then take my advice and let your light shine. If your message bears any power at all, it will be seen clearly through your kindness, charity, and your ability to have discussion without preaching.

(September 16, 2014 at 3:38 pm)C4RM5 Wrote:

(September 16, 2014 at 3:33 pm)ShaMan Wrote: I'm not offended, I just thought I'd sent up a flag before things become unnecessarily messy. I honestly understand - I once would have said the same thing to someone who left the faith.

Consider this; I lived as a christian for many years, and I probably experienced many of the things which you are now experiencing. You, on the other hand, have never been where I am now, and therefore you have no way of legitimately addressing (or refuting) my current mindset.

My time as a christian was an extremely valuable education which lends itself daily to my every consideration. Take from that statement what you will.

It is true , I haven't experienced life without God as I was saved at a young age and have an extremely bad memory(For example I wouldn't be able to tell you what I had for dinner 2 nights ago)
I also never wanted to come on to this fourm and say "your wrong" all I wanted to do was give a Christian view on life.

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(September 16, 2014 at 3:35 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: No it's not for nothing. The only way you get that eternal life (supposedly) is by praising and worshipping him. Obviously you think I'm going to Hell, as I don't believe in God or his alter-ego Jesus. It's not free eternal life, it's conditional, it has a price.

It is not conditional, for instance I have heard people telling me that they never intended to be saved. But God spoke to them and they got saved and now they worship him.

Tell me, am I going to hell?

(September 16, 2014 at 3:43 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote:

(September 16, 2014 at 3:38 pm)C4RM5 Wrote: It is true , I haven't experienced life without God as I was saved at a young age and have an extremely bad memory(For example I wouldn't be able to tell you what I had for dinner 2 nights ago)
I also never wanted to come on to this fourm and say "your wrong" all I wanted to do was give a Christian view on life.

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It is not conditional, for instance I have heard people telling me that they never intended to be saved. But God spoke to them and they got saved and now they worship him.

Tell me, am I going to hell?

If you believe in christ you are not going to christ.
If you don't believe in christ you are on the path to going to Hell. You can still be saved and avoid this.

(September 16, 2014 at 3:45 pm)C4RM5 Wrote:

(September 16, 2014 at 3:43 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: Tell me, am I going to hell?

If you believe in christ you are not going to christ.
If you don't believe in christ you are on the path to going to Hell. You can still be saved and avoid this.

And how do I become saved.

(September 16, 2014 at 3:43 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: Tell me, am I going to hell?

Hell, like heaven, are states of mind. I was in hell when I was a christian because my state of mind was furious with hellfire. I am now in heaven, chillin' with christ, smokin' a J.

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(September 16, 2014 at 3:47 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: And how do I become saved.

I've tried this with christians. They quote the bible but fail to give any clear hope that it may actually be true.

(September 16, 2014 at 3:47 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote:

(September 16, 2014 at 3:45 pm)C4RM5 Wrote: If you believe in christ you are not going to christ.
If you don't believe in christ you are on the path to going to Hell. You can still be saved and avoid this.

And how do I become saved.

Really you have to say sorry to God for the bad things you have done and the good things you haven't done. You hzve to then ask him into your life to help you live a good life according to God.

In other words when a sinner reaches up to God, God reaches down.

(September 16, 2014 at 3:51 pm)C4RM5 Wrote:

(September 16, 2014 at 3:47 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: And how do I become saved.

Relly hou have to say sorry to God for the bad things you have done and the good things you haven't done. You hzve to then ask him into your life to help you live a good life according to God.

In other words when a sinner reaches up to God, God reaches down.

That is the defintion of a condition. Salvation is not unconditional if I have to do something to warrant it first.

If salvation were unconditional, there would no such thing as Hell, and everyone would go to Heaven if if they were atheist, muslim, zoroastrian, or christian.