We actually have some pretty good laws on the books just about everywhere - we just don't enforce them. That should change.

(November 24, 2014 at 12:57 pm)Brian37 Wrote: Good, then stop defending the makers or the NRA, they are the main cause of gun death of both legal and illegal guns. I do not want to force them out of existence. I simply want them to be MORE responsible about how many they make, the types they make, and care about were they end up. They have done a horrible job of problem solving. Just like big oil did not want to face that led was really causing a problem with the environment and health.

Don't make excuses for them.

I'm haven't been, but you're kind of painting me into a corner where I will.... I don't think that we can blame the NRA for the silly shit that people do with guns - even though I'm perfectly comfortable blaming them for their own stupidity when they make comments about the silly shit that people do with guns - or when they fund obstructionism when it comes to enforcement of existing laws or adoption of better laws. Now look what you made me do...I have to go wash my fucking hands with bleach......

Manufacturers -already are- very responsible with how the guns are made, what safety features are included, and where those guns go from their hands. They have to be, there are alot of standards and laws in play..plus pressure from competition. None of that implies sainthood or moral fortitude or anything like that - but I'm a pragmatist. Whether a business does the right thing because they want to or because they are forced to matters very little to me - so long as the right thing is done.

The problems you think gun manufacturers should be more stringent in solving are not problems that they are -capable- of solving. That's not an excuse, and no excuse is necessary from their corner. You want to point the finger? Point it at the jackasses that do silly shit, law enforcement for not enforcing the law, and the public for focusing on everything -except- what might solve the problem.

(November 24, 2014 at 10:51 am)Brian37 Wrote: You sound like the Koch brothers. Keep it up.

You should actually read what he's writing, and then, you know, respond to it.

(November 24, 2014 at 10:58 am)FatAndFaithless Wrote: *Backs of slowly, not making any sudden movements*

Okayy...

I see the padawan is learning...

---

You've got to love how Brian politicizes a clear-cut case of human stupidity.

(November 24, 2014 at 2:09 pm)Parkers Tan Wrote:

(November 24, 2014 at 10:51 am)Brian37 Wrote: You sound like the Koch brothers. Keep it up.

You should actually read what he's writing, and then, you know, respond to it.

That's okay, we'll wait~

sorry to butt in.. "guns don't kill people people do" so it's a argument of clichés like most politicized arguments become. I agree that more people have guns that probably should based on their intelligence, mental stability, etc. However, the real problem, to me, are the fomenters, the media, the babbling nabobs of AM radio, the internet (we get what we pay for), and to a large extent religion and the way it isolates itself from science and rationality. These are the problems. The rest of it is just stuff. Stuff is here to stay. If we want to survive we need to wise up and see the problems, get involved in making progressive changes, fact check ours and others facts, don't support those that capitalize on human frailties and stupidities. We should use our considerable economic power to support a rational government as it was meant by the founding fathers. We have a common enemy in the oligarchs and the blathering religious meatheads. Let's unite around that change things for the better. Understand that humans will make mistakes no matter how sanitized you try to make the world. We've been killing each other for no good reason for millennia. That's not going to change overnight. If there weren't guns, we'd use swords, clubs, stones, our fists and feet-- and we have.

Ehh..I personally find it a stretch to connect the "come and take mah guns!" attitude to religion. It's more of a fantatical reverence for the poorly-worded second amendment.

As I said, religion provides a rationalization for an us and them reflex to tribalism and against the dangerous other. Guns or the weapon of the day has always accompanied religious belief.

(November 25, 2014 at 6:03 pm)raincrow Wrote: As I said, religion provides a rationalization for an us and them reflex to tribalism and against the dangerous other. Guns or the weapon of the day has always accompanied religious belief.

In my mind it's rather a still existing frontier mentality.

But I know what I'm talking about. My country has nearly as liberal gun laws as the USA and we have nearly as many deaths by gun per capita. The only difference being that our people seem to take it out on themselves, since most of the gun deaths are suicides.

But when it's hunting season, there's hardly a week when some hunter doesn't shoot a fellow hunter because he thought him to be a boar.

(November 24, 2014 at 10:47 am)Brian37 Wrote: This is about marketing.

Could you show some examples of the offending adverts?

(November 25, 2014 at 11:26 pm)KUSA Wrote:

(November 24, 2014 at 10:47 am)Brian37 Wrote: This is about marketing.

Could you show some examples of the offending adverts?

How about it Brian? Surely you have something.