(April 29, 2015 at 8:45 am)Bad Wolf Wrote: Do you want me to keep going? because I could. Or do you get the point?

I'm guessing this is rhetorical dude? Think we know the answer by now hahaha.

Wolf - It's curious that in our last conversation me (and another member, don't remember who) asked for reasonable evidence for a claim and you didn't provide it under the excuse that I was being too aggressive, as if my tone was relevant to the fact I was right or wrong - And I wasn't being very aggressive, I only asked you to think a little about some topics and maybe consider some variables you could accidentally have forgotten. There's nothing wrong with that. Have you considered that maybe the "you are misinterpreting me" is something people do frequently to run away from the fact they're wrong? Because I see it happening all the time. Politicians are a good example, when they say something controversial they come up on national TV a week later and say "this is just au ha misunderstanding, people are confusing things, that's not what I meant".

When I'm wrong but not consciously aware of it I try to tell people they don't understand me and double down. that's natural behaviour and it's an instinct of running away from responsibility.

If you want to discuss something with me, go ahead, I'm not going to insult or troll you, I'll debate rationally, and I don't let bad blood from former debates get in the way of things.

I've already asked Napoléon to explain with precision what he means exactly and I'm open to listen the other side, it's not my fault he refuses to do it because of "bad blood" and my aggressiveness.

(April 29, 2015 at 9:22 am)Dystopia Wrote: I've already asked Napoléon to explain with precision what he means exactly and I'm open to listen the other side, it's not my fault he refuses to do it because of "bad blood" and my aggressiveness.

I already have explained with precision dumbass. Several fucking times.

I'm not explaining jack shit else to you, not because of "bad blood", or your aggressiveness (top kek), but because you seem literally incapable of deciphering the simplest statements.

(April 29, 2015 at 9:29 am)Napoléon Wrote:

(April 29, 2015 at 9:22 am)Dystopia Wrote: I've already asked Napoléon to explain with precision what he means exactly and I'm open to listen the other side, it's not my fault he refuses to do it because of "bad blood" and my aggressiveness.

I already have explained with precision dumbass. Several fucking times.

I'm not explaining jack shit else to you, not because of "bad blood", or your aggressiveness (top kek), but because you seem literally incapable of deciphering the simplest statements.

Ok so let's revise the main topic:

- The title is for blacks to stop blaming racism. I don't think a sane person would ever say that it's ok to not punish people because of racism, and no one argued that crimes or violence perpetuated by blacks shouldn't be fought accordingly. I agreed on this when you said I was making "excuses" and I said "No, people should be punished regardless of race".

Now, a good question is "why not blame racism"? As you said, it's about economics and I added the fact race plays a part as well, so if you can conclude that institutional racism is one of the primary causes of the situation of a decent number of blacks, why shouldn't you blame racism? That doesn't make violence ok, and it's not an excuse to justify anything bad, but it's certainly a cause that needs to be fought because it leads people to despair and anger. I don't think riots are ok, but riots don't happen just because it's cool to engage in one, it happens because someone is mad at something.

Did I miss anything? I'm asking honestly, so if you don't mind you can reply instead of just calling me "dumbass"

Institutionalized poverty, dial back the meter and you'll find that any given race has found themselves on the slavery end of that stick.  The slave trade as generally conceived of today originally blossomed to service the multinational sugar trade (it was the oil of it's day).  They pressed the disadvantaged to work the fields.  The disadvantaged, at that time, were largely west africans.  The descendants of those people have not -significantly- increased either their cultural or economic standing since then within this culture...and in part (at the least..I hope no one argues a part) that's due to continued...institutionalized...poverty.  The driving force for slavery in the first place.  Programs and cultures which disproportionally impoverish a particular race are, point of fact, racist.  So....I don't see the problem with implicating race, even blaming racism (and yes, slavery) for some of ones problems.  It can be (though it isn't always) a legitimate explanation for the circumstances one finds oneself in.  

Sure, sure, people can make different choices.....all hail black exceptionalism!  Pro-tip, where you die isn't very far from where you were born.  The US has about as much upward social mobility as medeival europe.  If you see that everyone around you with a similar ethnic, cultural, and economic background is in largely the same place that probably doesn't have much to do with everyone making the same choices.  Even as a concept for a thought experiment the notion is unworkable.    Why is it that a large demographic, despite mountains of disparate choices....end up in the same socio-economic rut?  If the only solution is to be "different than the rest of them" you've bought into black exceptionalism...but also..more amusingly, you've acknowledged white supremecy...lol.

I'm not going with "seemingly". Come back with some numbers.

(April 29, 2015 at 11:29 am)thesummerqueen Wrote: I'm not going with "seemingly". Come back with some numbers.

Did you even read what I wrote? Did you watch either of the videos I used as an example of what I'm talking about?

"Even if it's 0.00000000001% of the population of black people in America that think this way, that's not the point."

God damn I'm out. You're being intentionally ignorant here.

You know what, if people aren't going to be arsed to read the points in the thread, don't bother responding. Even the shit Rhythm brought up, it's already been talked about. Pretty much everything you said Rhythm, in terms of history and reasons for the current situation, nobody disputes.

"If the only solution". Nobody is talking about single solutions. We're talking about a solution, not the solution. We're talking about what people in black communities can do to help themselves. But fuck, the point still seems to be lost on many people reading this thread.

I think many who burned buildings were frustrated but many others were just looking for an excuse to steal as much as they could.

(April 29, 2015 at 11:39 am)Manowar Wrote: I think many who burned buildings were frustrated but many others were just looking for an excuse to steal as much as they could.

And it doesn't do any good in stopping the unjustified stereotypes like this.