Still struggling.

[Socratic Meth Head]

There's one easy fix matey.
You're obviously pretty clever.

If you think you are up to it, forget the ego bullshit fights.
Go along with everything! You've changed your mind, you're a believer again.

That then takes all the pressure off you, life is back to normal.
They leave you alone again. Now you have all the time in the world to read your books in peace and privacy.

Then when you are ready to leave home, tell them what you really think.
Remember, the joke's on them.... Go through the motions.
Myself and my 2 older sisters happily took mum to church often.
We couldn't give 2 fucks about religion, but it made her happy in her later years...

Do it for your own sanity. It will make you stronger and you'll see them for the immature dicks that they are.
That will reinforce your atheism I believe.

I can't tell if this is supposed to be a serious response. I COULD lie to them and just let them leave me alone, but if they can't tolerate and accept that I don't believe in their god or ANY god at that, they are narrow-minded. This could help them learn to tolerate others beliefs, but in terms of debate, I wish to be left alone.

[pocaracas]

I keep trotting out this old old quote from Star Trek V, the Final Frontier...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9sqkahSziU


Consider your parents and brothers as the starship...
If any god wants me to be convinced that it exists, then it should show itself. The fact that it doesn't show itself is proof that it does not want me to acknowledge it. Why do people presume to tell me what it wants?

A god that needs a starship "is not the god of Sha Ka Ree, nor any other god."

[robvalue]

I think Ignor was being serious, and I have to say, it's an option worth considering. It's really sad that your family show you so little respect.

It seems like the short term plan is to get through the next few years however you can until you can move away. Pretending and going through the motions just to get some peace is, I believe, a viable option. Anyone can say they're a Christian. Only you can know whether they would buy it, though.

They're being so ridiculously harsh that your other options are seeming limited. I'm thinking:

"The more you push me around and disrespect my rights to believe what I want while I'm under your roof, the less contact I'll have with you once I move out."

My parents did something very similar, although not regarding religion. They blew it, they treated me like crap while I was "at their mercy" and now I barely talk to them.

The other possibility is to seek advice from your school or anywhere else impartial you can get to. Certainly your mother blocking your appointments is grounds for you to receive support, and maybe you can add to that being hounded all the time just for not sharing their beliefs. Or even contacting a helpline for abused children.

I'm really sorry you have to go through this. Religion is poison to the mind and your family has let it rot their most basic values in taking care of you.

One more extreme idea: "If you don't stop hassling me, I'm going to become a Muslim."

[Socratic Meth Head]

Your brother's being an absolutely dishonest and nasty sort of a shithead. Nobody "converts" religious believers to atheism, and why this is impossible has been pointed out. The next time he starts up with his shit, look him directly in the eye and ask him why he really believes what he says he does. You know he isn't being honest about this, if he ever "converted" to atheism for any reason other than attention-seeking. If he ever had a quarter of the reasoning in his head which you display here, then he still has it now, he just resorted to lying about it so that he could be the bully like your mom, because it's easier than toughing it out on the high road like you are now. You are a far better man than your brother for that, so don't ever let him make you forget it! Take control of every conversation he starts up, and hit him square in the chops with probing questions. When you ask "why" in the context of factual reason, he will reply with reasons in the prescriptive context (i.e. why he sees it as expedient to make that "believer" claim in place of rational observation of the evidence, which he has none of), which is fallaciously tactical. Unpack that shit for him, fallacy by fallacy, which he will flailingly continue to spin desperately until he gets tired and walks away.

If you haven't already studied logical fallacies, it helps a lot to know them all, and by name, so that you will be able to call them out on your feet whenever those arguing for their faith deploy them. Here's one source:

https://rationalskeptic.wordpress.com/th...fallacies/

Did we "convert" you? You found your way to us on your own, at some point after you stopped believing. I don't know about others, but I for one care a lot about not seeing you give in to your brother and your mom because you, like everyone else has the fundamental right to believe what they see as true, and to state that publicly (least of all with their family members) and not have to deal with the hateful sort of harassment which you are getting for it.

I'll check out the website here in a minute. He says he was a Christian, then became an atheist, then back to Christian.
No you didn't "convert" me. I gave up religion and my OCD doubts led me to come here asking if anyone else struggled with doubt and I was curious at the time if it was OCD or just indoctrination and both have played a factor, but it was mostly OCD. I was very lucky to meet you people because you all seem much more reasonable (with a few exceptions) than any creationist or even my parents.

When I first gave up religion I had zero second thoughts. It just happened. 2 weeks later OCD stopped attacking my sexuality and started attacking my faith or lack thereof. My brother made a claim like I only become atheist because I want comfort for my sin, but I've never felt guilty about sin when I was a Christian. (Except for masturbation because of how horribly my parents painted it.) He tries to tell me I will end up the same as him, I try to ration it our, OCD feeds off of it and intrudes, I get doubt/small anxiety, I obsess, I re-assure, it happens again. This will happen until I develop a new obsession. Sucks man, I never get HOCD thoughts now, ONLY religious thoughts. I need a positive obsession, or something I can obsess over and not get anxiety. I lost interest in things after depression though, so it will be hard to get interested and obsessed with something again.

[robvalue]

As you now realize, "sin" isn't a real thing. Even if it was, it's an absurd concept. Something that upsets God? Why is a god having very human-like feelings? Why is the creator of the whole universe so easily distressed by the actions of a few organisms scuttling around a tiny piece of rock?

And also, who cares? He should grow up. Stupid God.

[Socratic Meth Head]

I think Ignor was being serious, and I have to say, it's an option worth considering. It's really sad that your family show you so little respect.

It seems like the short term plan is to get through the next few years however you can until you can move away. Pretending and going through the motions just to get some peace is, I believe, a viable option. Anyone can say they're a Christian. Only you can know whether they would buy it, though.

They're being so ridiculously harsh that your other options are seeming limited. I'm thinking:

"The more you push me around and disrespect my rights to believe what I want while I'm under your roof, the less contact I'll have with you once I move out."

My parents did something very similar, although not regarding religion. They blew it, they treated me like crap while I was "at their mercy" and now I barely talk to them.

The other possibility is to seek advice from your school or anywhere else impartial you can get to. Certainly your mother blocking your appointments is grounds for you to receive support, and maybe you can add to that being hounded all the time just for not sharing their beliefs. Or even contacting a helpline for abused children.

I'm really sorry you have to go through this. Religion is poison to the mind and your family has let it rot their most basic values in taking care of you.

One more extreme idea: "If you don't stop hassling me, I'm going to become a Muslim."

I'm homeschooled, I would have to walk across town to get to my therapist since I can't drive. I think I'll just tell them that all they are doing by bothering me is making me resent them more than I already do now. My parents always fight, my brother is set on turning me christian, recently one of my dogs was attacked and is on an IV with tubes in him because he can't sustain himself otherwise, we had to get rid of our new dog, Sophie, because she likely was causing the uproar among our dogs, and now OCD intrudes on me mentally and i can't get any relief or escape from anxiety or doubt. I just want peace, for anything. Whether its truly believing ANYTHING I say, or whether I just want a calmer life. I can't have any of it. I;ve literally doubted things that I was 100% certain about and In the end, I was right and the doubt was wrong. I can never get peace though. I guess I'll put up with it and try my best to get my other brother from another mother (and that's accurate) to take me to my therapist since my mom wont.

[pocaracas]

Positive OCD to the rescue!!



Riddle me this, OCD boy!

[robvalue]

I'm very sorry to hear about your dogs

Sounds like a good plan regarding your brother. I don't know if it would be possible to request you be not home schooled anymore because of the way they are treating you.

[Edwardo Piet]

Positive OCD to the rescue!!



Riddle me this, OCD boy!

And here's me just seeing a sexual image.

[Socratic Meth Head]

I'm very sorry to hear about your dogs

Sounds like a good plan regarding your brother. I don't know if it would be possible to request you be not home schooled anymore because of the way they are treating you.

It's a loose loose, if I go back to public school then I am constantly in a situation of inescapable anxiety and doubt. I have always been very poorly focused and in an environment like public school I am no better off. With Homeschool, I am able to do it on my own time, and I have my own schedule, so if something happens (anxiety attacks or things of that nature) then I can just take a break, but at the same time I am going to be at odds with my parents 24/7 so they will be triggering doubt and anxiety. (You can see how much I have to shape my life around not getting anxiety just to live even just a little happy.) I'd much rather just eventually get the point across that I won't give in to means of religious conversion, and continue being homeschooled.

And whoever said "Positive OCD to the rescue!" Its a little more like "trying to focus on something 24/7 that doesn't give you anxiety!". I've heard of people who have learned to take advantage of OCD and cope with it to become a better person, but it seems very far fetched that OCD does anything other than harm to the abused.