Not every pedophile is a rapist.

[paulpablo]

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Just to stick in a few of my thoughts on the subject.........

I don't get how you could come to the conclusion that pedophiles are either born that way or not. 

I have no proof either way but I feel like I've picked up my sexual preferences through my life rather than been born with them.  Not to be confused with my sexuality.  I'm talking about age preferences, look, personality types and so on.

I don't think there's a perfect age for people to begin having sex.  I do think outrage against having sex with prepubescent, or just not very well developed young people, is a good thing. 

I think it goes along with not hitting children and properly educating children as being a step forward in civilisation.

The campaigns that you think the government should spend money on informing the general public about what pedophilia is, why?

I can understand some campaigns in schools getting children informed about people might try to take advantage of them sexually, and what they should do about it and so on.

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But campaigns informing what pedophilia is?  You would simply need leaflets saying "Pedophilia or paedophilia is a psychiatric disorder in which an adult or older adolescent experiences a primary or exclusive sexual attraction to prepubescent children"
But I don't see the point.

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Anyway, I DEFINITELY recommend that you or anyone interested in this topic should watch a documentary, by Louis Theroux called "A place for Peadophiles"

It shows a place dedicated to trying to help out these offenders.  The impression that I personally got from the documentary is that help for the most part is false hope, the people there doing the helping didn't have a clue, Louis Theroux seemed to talk to them in a more intelligent way than the doctors did and observed more things about them.

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So you think if it's not exclusive or primary(if it's secondary instead) then it's ok/not as much of a problem, and people shouldn't even be called pedophiles for that?

I posted that as an example of why I think a campaign telling people what pedophilia is would be useless.  That was the main point.

I don't agree with the definition I posted though, I didn't even read it as a was copying and pasting it from google.  It was just meant to be used as an example of a definition.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ygrd29-_O3I

Just another one to watch.

It includes that group NAMBLA. Not the north American Marlon Brando look alikes. It's the North American Man Boy love association.

[robvalue]

I'm surprised some people seem to think such urges are by choice. Maybe I'm misunderstanding. I don't know how, or indeed why, such urges would be generated. As Losty has pointed out previously, you don't have to be a paedophile to abuse a child anyway, of any age.

Well, irrationality is the human condition, isn't it? We should all strive to be more objective, but the fact is that that isn't really built into us.

Sure, yes. I agree we are generally pretty bad at it, especially when it's an emotional issue.

But as you say, we can try and identify when it is happening, and attempt to balance it.

[Excited Penguin]

So you think if it's not exclusive or primary(if it's secondary instead) then it's ok/not as much of a problem, and people shouldn't even be called pedophiles for that?

I posted that as an example of why I think a campaign telling people what pedophilia is would be useless.  That was the main point.

I don't agree with the definition I posted though, I didn't even read it as a was copying and pasting it from google.  It was just meant to be used as an example of a definition.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ygrd29-_O3I

Just another one to watch.

It includes that group NAMBLA.  Not the north American Marlon Brando look alikes.   It's the North American Man Boy love association.

It does seem like researchers and experts classify it as pedophilia only when it's exclusive or primary and that popular culture does differently. So I'll reiterate my point, if someone simply finds certain children attractive but doesn't feel sexual urges towards them as they do towards adults, nor does the thought of sexual activities with them appeal to them in reality, then I would 't classify such a person as a pedophile, nor would I have any reason to keep them away from my kids. I am curious if anyone else agrees with this. There are different kinds of attractions, I think, surely, not all of them sexual or worrying in any possible sense.

[Drich]

Another point I've raised before is how different things would be in a society where sex with children was acceptable. Are the negative psychological effects all to do with the shame of how society views them, and the constant requirement not to act on urges which have no acceptable outlet? Or does the condition itself inherently cause negative effects?

For some kids, it breaks their will to be an individual/independent of the the one defiling them. Others simply develop later if at all emotionally/mentally. Those who seek to retain their independence while being molested turn their anger on society/rebel or they turn on themselves and self mutilate or attempt suicide.

I've worked with kids who had it real bad... I didn't last a year, see the effect on them was too much..

So yes, the child has to endure alot of bad things for a very long time. the 'bad stuff' has nothing to do with societal shame, but a loss of control/innocence to know you and your buddies are not the same puts one in a self inflicted exile. Because to "play" or interact as your friends do is just a reminder of all that you lost.

[Edwardo Piet]

Thought experiment: lets say you put a brain of a 30 year old into a 14 year old's body.

If this person with a new brain gives you consent, is it okay to fuck them?

Let's say you are psychologically mature at the age of 10, does that change things?

Children are neither psychologically mature nor can they consent.

I was answering your question "is consent the only factor?" with "no".

Pushing Drich & His Demons and The World's Creepiest Game Show Host aside for a moment and going back to the thought experiment above.

How about another angle. Suppose someone is a legal adult, let's say well into adulthood at 35 years of age. Let's also say they are 100% psychologically mature (capable of consenting).

However let's say that despite being fully grown in height and size they have a condition where they haven't gone through puberty and they are therefore not biologically sexually mature.

If they consent is it immoral to have sex with this fully psychologically developed fully grown 35 year old if they aren't biologically sexually mature? If it is immoral then biological sexual maturity is most definitely a factor and not just consenting, psychological maturity and legality. If it is not immoral then biological sexual maturity is most definitely not a factor.

[Napoléon]

Now that's a question.

[Excited Penguin]

I'd say, regarding that thought experiment and any of its variants, as long as there's ability to understand and consent and there's no harm involved, non-consensually, that is, then it's ok.

[ohreally]

How about another angle. Suppose someone is a legal adult, let's say well into adulthood at 35 years of age. Let's also say they are 100% psychologically mature (capable of consenting).

However let's say that despite being fully grown in height and size they have a condition where they haven't gone through puberty and they are therefore not biologically sexually mature.

If they consent is it immoral to have sex with this fully psychologically developed fully grown 35 year old if they aren't biologically sexually mature? If it is immoral then biological sexual maturity is most definitely a factor and not just consenting, psychological maturity and legality. If it is not immoral then biological sexual maturity is most definitely not a factor.

Psychological development is dependant upon the maturing biological development of the the brain so they could have a biologically sexually mature brain just not secondary sexual characteristics.

Consent is based upon a mature brain not body.

[vorlon13]

There are documented cases of men (at least, why would I know about women?) not going thru puberty. All the plumbing is there, it just never activates.

[Losty]

Another point I've raised before is how different things would be in a society where sex with children was acceptable. Are the negative psychological effects all to do with the shame of how society views them, and the constant requirement not to act on urges which have no acceptable outlet? Or does the condition itself inherently cause negative effects?

For some kids, it breaks their will to be an individual/independent of the the one defiling them. Others simply develop later if at all emotionally/mentally. Those who seek to retain their independence while being molested turn their anger on society/rebel or they turn on themselves and self mutilate or attempt suicide.

I've worked with kids who had it real bad... I didn't last a year, see the effect on them was too much..

So yes, the child has to endure alot of bad things for a very long time. the 'bad stuff' has nothing to do with societal shame, but a loss of control/innocence to know you and your buddies are not the same puts one in a self inflicted exile. Because to "play" or interact as your friends do is just a reminder of all that you lost.

The question Rob was asking is if it negatively impacts the adult with the desire not the child.