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RE: How far reaching are God's powers?
November 15, 2020 at 3:43 pm
(November 15, 2020 at 3:32 pm)Peebo-Thuhlu Wrote: (November 15, 2020 at 3:21 pm)Sound Of Reason Wrote: Definition of terms => WCE = Whatever created everything.
a toaster is created, and WCE is not. So it makes all the difference.
Uhm... that comment only makes sense simply because you've defined it that way.
'WCE' might actually have been created by 'Something else' with an effective stasis point some where 'behind' or 'above' or otherwise 'else where' but still other than WCE.
Unless your defintiion of WCE is automatically larger that 'The Univers'?
Jus' sayin'.
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Definition of terms => WCE = Whatever created everything.
The concept of "Create" is made by WCE, so again it doesn't mean anything to say WCE has been created.
And also if we keep giving every creator a creator we're going to get lost in an infinite regress, and if a creature has an infinite number of creators above him,
he won't exist in the first place.
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RE: How far reaching are God's powers?
November 15, 2020 at 3:46 pm
(This post was last modified: November 15, 2020 at 3:47 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
The term won't be useful if we can't allow ourselves it's use. If whatever created the universe is a god, than not being an entity, not being a who, not being a he or a him...should not be a barrier to godhood.
If it is, then god is not an issue of whatever created the universe.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: How far reaching are God's powers?
November 15, 2020 at 4:02 pm
(November 15, 2020 at 3:43 pm)Sound Of Reason Wrote: Definition of terms => WCE = Whatever created everything.
The concept of "Create" is made by WCE, so again it doesn't mean anything to say WCE has been created.
And also if we keep giving every creator a creator we're going to get lost in an infinite regress, and if a creature has an infinite number of creators above him,
he won't exist in the first place.
Okay, I'm pretty sure I'm grokking what you're saying.
So in your definition what is or how far does the "EVERYTHING" extend?
Is it "JUST" the universe?
Is it 'Just the universe' PLUS something else 'beyond' 'Just the universe'?
I'm also not, definately NOT saying that your "EVERYTHING" leads to an infinte regress. I was saying that your 'EVERYTHING' creator could be part of a 'Larger' set of multiple "EVERYTHINGS".
Also, I see you've slipped in 'CreaTOR' in there. An extension on the idea of 'Create'. We're not at adding "-Tors" to anything just yet.
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RE: How far reaching are God's powers?
November 15, 2020 at 4:09 pm
(November 15, 2020 at 3:46 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: The term won't be useful if we can't allow ourselves it's use. If whatever created the universe is a god, than not being an entity, not being a who, not being a he or a him...should not be a barrier to godhood.
If it is, then god is not an issue of whatever created the universe.
Definition of terms => WCE = Whatever created everything.
God is just a name of WCE.
being an "entity" or a "who" or a "him" is what going to make the barrier, WCE is free from being those semantics.
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RE: How far reaching are God's powers?
November 15, 2020 at 4:11 pm
(November 15, 2020 at 4:09 pm)Sound Of Reason Wrote: Definition of terms => WCE = Whatever created everything.
God is just a name of WCE.
being an "entity" or a "who" or a "him" is what going to make the barrier, WCE is free from being those semantics.
Well... not if you're going to kind of be disengenous with your smuggling in 'Grokking agency' into your 'Everything'.
Jus' sayin'.
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RE: How far reaching are God's powers?
November 15, 2020 at 4:13 pm
(November 15, 2020 at 4:02 pm)Peebo-Thuhlu Wrote: (November 15, 2020 at 3:43 pm)Sound Of Reason Wrote: Definition of terms => WCE = Whatever created everything.
The concept of "Create" is made by WCE, so again it doesn't mean anything to say WCE has been created.
And also if we keep giving every creator a creator we're going to get lost in an infinite regress, and if a creature has an infinite number of creators above him,
he won't exist in the first place.
Okay, I'm pretty sure I'm grokking what you're saying.
So in your definition what is or how far does the "EVERYTHING" extend?
Is it "JUST" the universe?
Is it 'Just the universe' PLUS something else 'beyond' 'Just the universe'?
I'm also not, definately NOT saying that your "EVERYTHING" leads to an infinte regress. I was saying that your 'EVERYTHING' creator could be part of a 'Larger' set of multiple "EVERYTHINGS".
Also, I see you've slipped in 'CreaTOR' in there. An extension on the idea of 'Create'. We're not at adding "-Tors" to anything just yet.
Not at work.
Ok, I'm going to find something else to do because either my English is really bad or you can't understand me.
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RE: How far reaching are God's powers?
November 15, 2020 at 4:19 pm
(November 15, 2020 at 4:13 pm)Sound Of Reason Wrote: (November 15, 2020 at 4:02 pm)Peebo-Thuhlu Wrote: Okay, I'm pretty sure I'm grokking what you're saying.
So in your definition what is or how far does the "EVERYTHING" extend?
Is it "JUST" the universe?
Is it 'Just the universe' PLUS something else 'beyond' 'Just the universe'?
I'm also not, definately NOT saying that your "EVERYTHING" leads to an infinte regress. I was saying that your 'EVERYTHING' creator could be part of a 'Larger' set of multiple "EVERYTHINGS".
Also, I see you've slipped in 'CreaTOR' in there. An extension on the idea of 'Create'. We're not at adding "-Tors" to anything just yet.
Not at work.
Ok, I'm going to find something else to do because either my English is really bad or you can't understand me.
Sorry.
I'm just slowly trying to work though your thing with you. 
Not at work.
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RE: How far reaching are God's powers?
November 15, 2020 at 4:32 pm
@ Peebo-Thuhlu
It's Ok, my previous comments should be enough, if not, I'm not sure I can do any better.
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RE: How far reaching are God's powers?
November 15, 2020 at 4:33 pm
(This post was last modified: November 15, 2020 at 4:40 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(November 15, 2020 at 4:09 pm)Sound Of Reason Wrote: (November 15, 2020 at 3:46 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: The term won't be useful if we can't allow ourselves it's use. If whatever created the universe is a god, than not being an entity, not being a who, not being a he or a him...should not be a barrier to godhood.
If it is, then god is not an issue of whatever created the universe.
Definition of terms => WCE = Whatever created everything.
God is just a name of WCE.
God cannot be a name for whatever created the universe if it takes a whoever to satisfy the requirements of godhood.
Goes like this...
-God is "x"
here's an x
-not a god.
Then god is not x after all. More properly, including your silent premise
-a god is a whoever, that created the universe. Not whatever created the universe. Toasters need not apply. If a toaster could create a universe (a premise which you reject assuming that this is a point of contention), it would not be a god. Is that a fair and accurate summary of your requirements for godhood?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: How far reaching are God's powers?
November 15, 2020 at 5:33 pm
(November 15, 2020 at 4:33 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: (November 15, 2020 at 4:09 pm)Sound Of Reason Wrote: Definition of terms => WCE = Whatever created everything.
God is just a name of WCE.
God cannot be a name for whatever created the universe if it takes a whoever to satisfy the requirements of godhood.
Goes like this...
-God is "x"
here's an x
-not a god.
Then god is not x after all. More properly, including your silent premise
-a god is a whoever, that created the universe. Not whatever created the universe. Toasters need not apply. If a toaster could create a universe (a premise which you reject assuming that this is a point of contention), it would not be a god. Is that a fair and accurate summary of your requirements for godhood? Not to mention not all gods are creator gods
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