Sex vs. Christianity

[frankiej]

Wow... I don't really know where to start.

First I suggest moving this discussion elsewhere, but it might be a bit late for that.

I do notice that no true Scotsman is strong in this new pup.

Before I discuss anything with this guy, he will have to convince me why I should go for the Bible over other "Holy" books. It is all the same shite to me.

[Reforged]

Because you rightly feel disgust at an action he supposedly committed according to the Bible... and if he did not then why should you believe anything the Bible says? If that major part can be false then whos to say most of it isn't? If not all of it?

Supposedly is the word here.
Why, because whether you admit it or not, there are scientific facts revealed from an ancient ppl that I feel are impressive. The Bible also says things that I feel are true as well as false things.

Blind faith is not Biblical, it instructs the reader to use their mind and prove all things. I won't call a truth a lie if I can prove to myself it's not and vice-versa.

Others seems to have no problem calling the entire book a lie no matter how much truth they see. My world isn't black and white...

Yes, there are facts about ancients... none that indicate any of the events of the Bible taking place or the existence of a God.

You're a moral person without it, with it... what does it teach you? Ten commandments? You really think people before the ten commandments thought killing each other was all well and good? Come on man. Have you ever seriously sat down and read the bible? Thats how I became an atheist, it taught me all I needed to know about Christianity. You ever notice how most Christians haven't read the entire Bible?
You know why they haven't? Because its full of some of the most horrific things you will ever read and I promise you I am not bullshitting. Some things are open to interpretation but alot of what the Bible says? Doesn't leave alot of room. They don't want you to read the whole thing, just the bits they cherry pick.
And you know that... don't you.

[Cato]

You should also just back out quietly, we haven't even gotten past Genesis 1 and you've demonstrated a severe lack of knowledge about the Bible and/or basic language skills.

Genesis 1:26-27
King James Version (KJV)

26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.


"them" is the relevant word there. Unless you wish to claim that "them" means one person?

So, with your definitive position regarding the word 'them' you would agree that Jesus rode into Jerusalem on two asses, and not one. It's the inverse of toothpaste here, one of four gospels agree.

Hey catfish. Call me a troll? Here's one where I clearly wasn't trolling. Wan't me to fish up the rest?

[catfish]

BTW cato123, do you still adamantly deny more than 3 ppl at that specific time? Or do you concede that your basic understanding was lacking?

---

Yes, there are facts about ancients... none that indicate any of the events of the Bible taking place or the existence of a God.

You're a moral person without it, with it... what does it teach you? Ten commandments? You really think people before the ten commandments thought killing each other was all well and good? Come on man. Have you ever seriously sat down and read the bible? Thats how I became an atheist, it taught me all I needed to know about Christianity. You ever notice how most Christians haven't read the entire Bible?
You know why they haven't? Because its full of some of the most horrific things you will ever read and I promise you I am not bullshitting. Some things are open to interpretation but alot of what the Bible says? Doesn't leave alot of room. They don't want you to read the whole thing, just the bits they cherry pick.
And you know that... don't you.

Yes I know that, but when taken as a whole, you're supposed to cherry-pick. That's one of the reasons I believe it as a test. Good ppl will see good in it and bad ppl will see bad.

I tend to see the good in all things, whether true or not.

[Cato]

BTW cato123, do you still adamantly deny more than 3 ppl at that specific time? Or do you concede that your basic understanding was lacking?

Just indicating what the Bible said, like the original poster on the matter. The trouble is that if there is a line of human lineage, not Adam and Eve, the need for Jesus for the sake of forgiving Original Sin is destroyed.

You can't get around this even if you tried. Later, the only humans that survived the flood were Noah and his sons. OK, this is a little more tolerable, but now we're just fucking cousins.

[catfish]

Hey catfish. Call me a troll?

OK, you're a troll...

---

Just indicating what the Bible said, like the original poster on the matter. The trouble is that if there is a line of human lineage, not Adam and Eve, the need for Jesus for the sake of forgiving Original Sin is destroyed.

You can't get around this even if you tried. Later, the only humans that survived the flood were Noah and his sons. OK, this is a little more tolerable, but now we're just fucking cousins.

Original sin is not Biblical.

And the flood story doesn't specify a world-wide flood.

[Reforged]

BTW cato123, do you still adamantly deny more than 3 ppl at that specific time? Or do you concede that your basic understanding was lacking?

---

Yes, there are facts about ancients... none that indicate any of the events of the Bible taking place or the existence of a God.

You're a moral person without it, with it... what does it teach you? Ten commandments? You really think people before the ten commandments thought killing each other was all well and good? Come on man. Have you ever seriously sat down and read the bible? Thats how I became an atheist, it taught me all I needed to know about Christianity. You ever notice how most Christians haven't read the entire Bible?
You know why they haven't? Because its full of some of the most horrific things you will ever read and I promise you I am not bullshitting. Some things are open to interpretation but alot of what the Bible says? Doesn't leave alot of room. They don't want you to read the whole thing, just the bits they cherry pick.
And you know that... don't you.

Yes I know that, but when taken as a whole, you're supposed to cherry-pick. That's one of the reasons I believe it as a test. Good ppl will see good in it and bad ppl will see bad.

I tend to see the good in all things, whether true or not.

Who tells you you're supposed to cherry pick catfish? If one major plot point is untrue because you consider it immoral then do you understand how many others you'd consider to be untrue? If you went through with a marker and crossed out the bits you considered untrue because they're immoral it'd be at least 75% you blacked out. I promise you that.
Will you just read it? See how much good you see in it instead of allowing others to choose for you. If you allow them to how would you ever know for sure whats true and what isn't?
Do you realize that during this conversation you referenced the Bible to prove the Bible wasn't bullshit? On reflection you probably realize why that was abit silly. Who do you think drilled that into you?
It wasn't any of us cat.
You think we all just woke up one day and decided "I feel like burning in hell"? Alot of us come from religious backgrounds of all kinds you know. You think thats a fluke?
You think maybe, just maybe we looked at our religion, our holy books and came to the realization: "wait, what?"

[catfish]

Who tells you you're supposed to cherry pick catfish? If one major plot point is untrue because you consider it immoral then do you understand how many others you'd consider to be untrue? If you went through with a marker and crossed out the bits you considered untrue because they're immoral it'd be at least 75% you blacked out. I promise you that.
Will you just read it? See how much good you see in it instead of allowing others to choose for you. If you allow them to how would you ever know for sure whats true and what isn't?
Do you realize that during this conversation you referenced the Bible to prove the Bible wasn't bullshit? On reflection you probably realize why that was abit silly. Who do you think drilled that into you?
It wasn't any of us cat.
You think we all just woke up one day and decided "I feel like burning in hell"? Alot of us come from religious backgrounds of all kinds you know. You think thats a fluke?

I came from a religious family too, but even when I was 4 years old, I NEVER fell for any of that bullshit.

Hell's not real, in fact, the Bible predicts the introduction of myths. And the next passage contains a reference to Hades (hell) which we all know is a myth.

Did you at one time believe in "hell"?

---

1 Thessalonians 5:21
King James Version (KJV)

21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.

[C.W. Sims]

Genesis 7
17 For forty days the flood kept coming on the earth, and as the waters increased they lifted the ark high above the earth. 18 The waters rose and increased greatly on the earth, and the ark floated on the surface of the water. 19 They rose greatly on the earth, and all the high mountains under the entire heavens were covered. 20 The waters rose and covered the mountains to a depth of more than fifteen cubits.[g][h] 21 Every living thing that moved on land perished—birds, livestock, wild animals, all the creatures that swarm over the earth, and all mankind. 22 Everything on dry land that had the breath of life in its nostrils died. 23 Every living thing on the face of the earth was wiped out; people and animals and the creatures that move along the ground and the birds were wiped from the earth. Only Noah was left, and those with him in the ark.

24 The waters flooded the earth for a hundred and fifty days.

I would say that pretty definitively says that the flood covered the entire planet. I can't really see a way to get around that. Just saying.

---

You did get one right though, original sin is entirely extra-biblical and was completely created as a control mechanism for the Catholic Church.

[Reforged]

Who tells you you're supposed to cherry pick catfish? If one major plot point is untrue because you consider it immoral then do you understand how many others you'd consider to be untrue? If you went through with a marker and crossed out the bits you considered untrue because they're immoral it'd be at least 75% you blacked out. I promise you that.
Will you just read it? See how much good you see in it instead of allowing others to choose for you. If you allow them to how would you ever know for sure whats true and what isn't?
Do you realize that during this conversation you referenced the Bible to prove the Bible wasn't bullshit? On reflection you probably realize why that was abit silly. Who do you think drilled that into you?
It wasn't any of us cat.
You think we all just woke up one day and decided "I feel like burning in hell"? Alot of us come from religious backgrounds of all kinds you know. You think thats a fluke?

I came from a religious family too, but even when I was 4 years old, I NEVER fell for any of that bullshit.

Hell's not real, in fact, the Bible predicts the introduction of myths. And the next passage contains a reference to Hades (hell) which we all know is a myth.

Did you at one time believe in "hell"?

Yeah I did and I once believed in a heaven and a God. Until I looked at it properly. Do you know what the best way to control people is? Shock and awe. Make them feel fear, make them feel wonder, make them feel anything to prevent them from questioning and from thinking.
Can you think of anything, anything quite so frightening as burning forever? Or anything quite so wonderful as the promise of eternal paradise? I can't. But you can't question it. No. Can't present evidence for it either. Got to believe as hard as you can or you might not see your loved ones again. I think thats what stops most theists in their tracks you know. They need to believe it isn't the end, that they can resolve everything they left undone in the next life. They fear death with every ounce of themselves if they think for one second that might not be true.
What better means to control someone with than that?
But its not the truth, no-ones ever proved it is. All we've got is a smile and a promise. Thats all. And what if it isn't true? What then? Do you waste your life pursuing it? Under the control of the bastards who would use your loved ones memories against you like they were tools to be used?
Wouldn't it be better to live free as you like? As moral as you like? As happy as you like? To live this life, the only one we can be certain that we have and use the memories of the dead as inspiration for us to live and one we can hand down to our children? Isn't that, in a way a form of eternal life? One we can prove is real?
Make no mistake, religions weapons of choice are shock and awe. If you deny them that, you're free.