God is the great spirit friend

[The Grand Nudger]

Mr Infidel said [I'm paraphrasing] if everyone agreed that the testimony was valid, then everyone would agree that the testimony was valid.

Trivially true, but whether or not they agree that it is valid and whether or not it is accurate is not the same question. The problem with testimony is not that people offer it, or even that people are willing to accept it, or how many people accept any particular testimony, but that it is consistently unreliable for determining the accuracy of what it purports to be an account of.

[Lion IRC]

Mr Infidel said [I'm paraphrasing] if everyone agreed that the testimony was valid, then everyone would agree that the testimony was valid.

You seriously must learn some reading comprehension skills and cease misconstruing my comments.

Yes, in fairness its possible I misunderstood what you meant to say.
http://atheistforums.org/thread-17797-po...#pid417657

[The Grand Nudger]

Since when did sense and hallucination co-habitate? People do hallucinate mundane things on a near constant basis.

10 sane people hallucinating the same murderer the same victim, the same place, etc...that's not logical. But in a court room, it's always about beyond reasonable doubt. Because 100% certainty won't be achieved except rarely.

But the case of God, Angels, Jinn...there is an explanation, and that is the role of dogma and religion with mental illness or hallucinations.

What murder, they hallucinated it. What victim, again a hallucination. What place? These ten people saw a murder which no one else saw, there is no body to be found, there is no suspect to apprehend.......somebody check the water (or the bread). Whether the hallucinatin is comprised of jinn or cute little kitties the mechanism is the same. Its a fun subject, but I don't actually think we have to invoke hallucination for Strodels testimony (as an example). Lying for jesus is immensely more likely.

[Mystic]

I don't think he is lying.

[Lion IRC]

...But there is another explanation. It's called "hallucinations".

I dont think the word ''hallucination'' explains much of anything.
Who holds the epistemic ''rosetta stone'' to interpret and define objective reality?

Thank you quantum mechanics!

[The Grand Nudger]

That's because you're a more generous and patient person than I am Mystic..lol.

[FallentoReason]

What do you base your ethics on? Do you base them on a complicated argument or do you base them on intuition?

Your every day interactions with people are usually based on instincts. The pressing issues of today's society require more thought as they are usually complex issues (abortion, euthanasia etc).

The con man is not the one who receives truth, the con man is the one that invents truth and says that he receives it.

Hence why the con man has won. You've swallowed the sales pitch hook, line & sinker.

To be a little child is to stop creating and start receiving.

The little child and the con man are two different people... the con man tells everyone they need to have the faith of a child in order to "understand" spiritual truths. This malicious attempt to corrupt the mind is right up there with the backwards thinking of Paul, such as "the wisdom of the world is foolishness" because, you know, obviously the feats of science are pure foolishness and not intertwined with the truths of reality at all.

[Tonus]

You don't have any reason to believe I am suffering from any illness.

People who claim to see or hear things that no one else can see are typically considered to be suffering from hallucinations, and these are often brought on by illness. Therefore, there is reason for a person reading your claims to believe that you are suffering from illness, or using substances that may be causing your hallucinogenic state.

On the other hand, few people (even theists) believe that other people regularly receive visions or visits from god or his representatives. Thus, even a believer would have reason to doubt that you are seeing and talking to god. An atheist doesn't have any reason to think that your experiences are supernatural, and I suspect that you will never provide verifiable proof of your experiences.

[jstrodel]

No, that is what atheists typically think. People who see visions and hear things from God are considered to be in touch with the supernatural if they do not have some sort of mental defect that proves they are crazy, in virtually every other culture.

You are using mental health terminology to advance your movement. You don't have one bit of evidence that I am suffering at all, but that won't stop you, because you don't care about evidence, you care about advancing atheism.

It would be one thing to say "I do not believe that you have experienced these things and perhaps you have some mental issue". That is not the response I have received, which, in absence of any evidence, was to accuse me of having mental issues and attempt to defame my character through calling me crazy.

This is all done without evidence. Atheists have high standards that they require people have for making claims that involve religion, but when they involve atheism, every sort of propositional claim about anything can all fall under the non-rational atheist rejection of a religious claim, even though that claim depends on every single objection being true.

You won't produce a shred of evidence that links anything I have posted to a mental illness because you don't have any. You have suspicion and that is enough for you to pronounce me crazy in the kangaroo court of atheist "critical thinking".

[Kayenneh]

You know what Joe, take look at your last post and compare it to your first in this thread. The last one is coherent, well worded and you get your point across well. Your first thing is anything but. It's incoherent, many of the phrases are repeated over and over again and it frankly reminds of a mad man's rantings. And you wonder why the majority think that you have a couple (or a dozen) screws on the loose, it seems like those posts are made by two different people. Of all your posts I've read, every time you start mentioning your worldview and your thoughts about your god, you start rambling and get less and less lucid.. Any thoughts to why?