Women. Religion’s longestrunning victims.

[Bad Wolf]

I understand your feelings, which come from a worldview different than mine or that of other believing christians. If you choose to be a christian, this is something you must accept, but I see no reason to campaign to change christianity. Not all women agree with your opinion and are happy with their church and family situations. I say let women make their own choices. That's really true freedom. If they don't agree with the teachings of christianity, they can choose a different path.

North Koreans think they have a great life. In the real world, they are starving and oppressed by a leader with a god complex. They have no access to the internet, they have work camps, they have 3 generation prison sentences. And yet they don't revolt. Do you see what i'm getting at? Indoctrination.

I don't care if some Xian women are happy. The reality is, they shouldn't be.

---

Quite right, you can't just leave Christianity. You can't choose what you believe.

[Bibliofagus]

God did establish men to have the role of authority in the family and the church, but never declared women to be inferior.

That's pretty stupid knowing that many women can handle authority much better than their husbands can.

[Greatest I am]

But as I said, this is not about you. Perhaps if you consider that your daughter may need someone to do their duty to her.

Regards
DL

Perhaps I plan to raise my daughters and my son to be responsible for themselves.

As you should. But part of that is to be responsible to others as well and in this case, if you wish to have moral children, you will teach them to put others ahead of them and not behind them.

Morals should be other centered and not self-centered.

Regards
DL

[Losty]

As applies to both genders equally my dear.

[Greatest I am]

As applies to both genders equally my dear.

Absolutely. A woman's morals should tell her that he first responsibility is to family and that means that children come first, then herself, and lastly the father who, if moral, will insist on the woman letting him do his duty based on his good morals and dedication to his family.

Regards
DL

[Lek]

North Koreans think they have a great life. In the real world, they are starving and oppressed by a leader with a god complex. They have no access to the internet, they have work camps, they have 3 generation prison sentences. And yet they don't revolt. Do you see what i'm getting at? Indoctrination.

I don't care if some Xian women are happy. The reality is, they shouldn't be.

It seems like you and FatAndFaithless are the ones who are looking down on women. You believe that while living in today's society-- and with all the access to TV and internet--christian women are not smart enough to realize that they are "oppressed" and make a decision to leave their situation. In fact, many have left christianity, and the same time, many have come into christianity. Bad Wolf has already decided that if they're happy, then they shouldn't be. What do you want to do--take them into camps and indoctrinate them with your beliefs?

[FatAndFaithless]

What do you want to do--take them into camps and indoctrinate them with your beliefs?

Nah, that's way more the Christian camp flavor.

[Bad Wolf]

It seems like you and FatAndFaithless are the ones who are looking down on women. You believe that while living in today's society-- and with all the access to TV and internet--christian women are not smart enough to realize that they are "oppressed" and make a decision to leave their situation.

No. I didn't say they are not smart, you just said that. Notice how I didn't call the North Koreans stupid. You could be the smartest person in the world and still be indoctrinated. Intelligence is irrelevant. BTW I think that Xian men are equally indoctrinated and equally as intelligent as the women.

In fact, many have left christianity,

Many men do this as well. Gender is irrelevant.

and the same time, many have come into christianity.

You don't have to be stupid to make bad decisions and fall for bad reasoning. Besides, the Christianity advertised is nothing like the Christianity in the bible. The sexism is a lot less obvious yet still present, subtle enough to appear as though it isn't there.

Bad Wolf has already decided that if they're happy, then they shouldn't be.

Funny how you left out the reason that they shouldn't be, isn't it?
Tell me Lek, do you think the North Koreans should be happy? Please answer.

What do you want to do--take them into camps and indoctrinate them with your beliefs?

And here you demonstrate that you don't know what atheism is. As an atheist, I have no beliefs. As an atheist.

Instead of teaching them what to think, I would teach them how to think. You know? (or maybe you don't) critical thinking skills, the ability to analyse claims and events.

[Esquilax]

It seems like you and FatAndFaithless are the ones who are looking down on women. You believe that while living in today's society-- and with all the access to TV and internet--christian women are not smart enough to realize that they are "oppressed" and make a decision to leave their situation.

The human mind, especially in childhood, is extremely malleable to persistent pressures upon it, irrespective of intelligence. We wouldn't have half the mental illnesses we do if that wasn't the case. I consider myself to be quite smart- with an academic record to back that up- and yet I have an extreme, irrational phobia of deep water and being submerged stemming from a certain set of childhood experiences that don't bear repeating. My rational mind sees no threat in a swimming pool, it knows that I know how to swim, but my rational mind simply is not in the driver's seat there.

It's the same with religion; enough reinforcement and so on, early enough in development especially, can be very hard to break even for geniuses.

What do you want to do--take them into camps and indoctrinate them with your beliefs?

I really don't think the person whose religion hosts a ton of bible camps and Jesus camps and childhood programs has much room to be chastising anyone else about camps and indoctrination.