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General questions about the Christian idea of God and love
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RE: General questions about the Christian idea of God and love
September 16, 2014 at 2:48 pm
(This post was last modified: September 16, 2014 at 2:49 pm by Mudhammam.)
(September 16, 2014 at 11:23 am)fr0d0 Wrote:(September 16, 2014 at 7:55 am)genkaus Wrote: Facts didn't let us down - religious suppositions did. What "facts" are you referring to as contributors to the level of bigotry that Christianity, Islam, and other relevant faiths have infected mainstream culture with?
He who loves God cannot endeavour that God should love him in return - Baruch Spinoza
Those facts blamed on religious bigotry are much more likely best attempts at explaining weak scientific knowledge, if there is such a thing, because as we know, all scientific knowledge is subject to revision. Flat earth, for example...
During the early Church period, with some exceptions, most held a spherical view, for instance, Augustine, Jerome, and Ambrose to name a few. And then there's the abuse of religion by those wanting to assert control to get power. Those things are people acting as people do. Not people acting upon religious direction. Tldr. Even the religious bigotry you cite is not a result of religious teaching but of human failing. RE: General questions about the Christian idea of God and love
September 16, 2014 at 3:42 pm
(This post was last modified: September 16, 2014 at 3:47 pm by Mudhammam.)
(September 16, 2014 at 3:00 pm)fr0d0 Wrote: Even the religious bigotry you cite is not a result of religious teaching but of human failing. Except that we both know the most cherished religious texts of Christians, Muslims, and Jews are littered with passages encouraging xenophoia and bigotry. Drich even says God is so petty that he hates people for their contrary beliefs (or lack thereof). And unlike so-called scientific "truths" that have been revised (which is already saying a lot about its superiority as a method), deep-seeded disagreement i.e. the very idea of revising any text alleged to be God's word--on the basis of faith--is itself considered blasphemous.
He who loves God cannot endeavour that God should love him in return - Baruch Spinoza
RE: General questions about the Christian idea of God and love
September 16, 2014 at 4:09 pm
(This post was last modified: September 16, 2014 at 4:10 pm by fr0d0.)
I don't see any substance in your accusations, about my faith anyway. My opinion of Islam is that it's barbaric, but I defer to people who know better than I do.
I've discussed that with Drich and can find nothing against the idea of a loving God. I've seen these subjects argued hard too and inconclusively. So I can't seriously concur. Science is great. I love it. It's strength is also it's weakness. Let's not get blurry eyed. Religious truth shouldn't change if it's truth. It's already revised enough. And we find it to be correct. You use emotive words. I'm free to adhere or object as I please. I haven't seen it bettered yet. (September 15, 2014 at 9:52 am)Drich Wrote:(September 15, 2014 at 9:29 am)Chas Wrote: With swords and fire as always. No, sorry. Having reasons is not having a reasoned argument or belief. You continue to have dreadful reading comprehension.
Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method. RE: General questions about the Christian idea of God and love
September 16, 2014 at 4:27 pm
(This post was last modified: September 16, 2014 at 4:28 pm by Hellfire1014.)
I could not get the quote thing down, so I'll just bold the stuff.
Nobody will burn in hell because hell doesn't exist. It's a fantasy. I'd rather not take the chance to find out otherwise. I don't think (your) version of god exists so I don't think 'it' sees anything. I think it's good a little bit that you at least think some version of god exist's. Not all doubting. I only hope my version of god exist's, because it's the faith I'm following. You're right. Nobody would want that. Agreed. But I think you're making it all up. If it is all made up I'm not the one who did make it all up. Maybe in my mind I am. Using threats of eternal punishment derived entirely from your imagination isn't scary and neither is it threatening. It's just, well, weird. I'm not using threats. Only quoting what I believe. I suppose I am kind of a weird person though. Not for my religion though. You sound like a confused individual. MY recommendation would be to ditch the bible crap and go seek some real advice from real people. Entirely your choice, naturally, but there's nothing wrong with porn, masturbating, following some religious woo like Chakras or indeed being gay. You've been told there is a problem with these things by people who espouse a philosophy derived from a supposed celestial entity. It's a nonsense. You've been told not take responsibility for anything; if it's 'bad' is the devil, if it's 'good' then it's all god's work. It's netiehr, it's entirely you and the circumstances around you. Get an A on a test? God did fuck all. You did it. Fail that test? That's entirely on you. buddy. Why do I sound confused? My problem's with these things? If I look at porn I'm satisfied with that, and do not seek out a relationship. If I look at porn in a relationship then I would not be fair to my wife. Problem with masturbating? Lack of self control? Build's self control. Although I have control with other things in my life this only builds more by abstaining. It might of been torture the first few days, but that subsides. Nothing wrong with the chakra stuff? Well how can people believe in some energy locations on the body, but not believe in god? The chakra stuff? I'd rather not even get into it. I've read horror stories. Kundalini awakening all that. It can mess up your body due to being part of your nervous system. In my religion it would be opening the door to demons, and maybe a seat for them to reside. Lots of problems with being gay. Stretched anus, diseases, anal fissures, hemeroids, what else? You're right most of the bad stuff is from the circumstance around you. The big corporations polluting, your neighbor who does not hold to the word of god so they're naturally a bad person, environment, people are assholes. Think for yourself and you'll be happier for it. I am thinking for myself. Just because I follow god does not make me a robot. I too had that fear. Would I not be the same person I was? I am still the same person. Just happier for it. I can feel the change in my life this way. I was much less happier before. You'll probably say "whatever works for you" To my above statement, and you're right. Whatever works for you. I can't change other people. God gave them choice. There is no such thing as sin, and as such, I am not a 'sinner'. I'm a human being. Well if you don't believe it then I suppose there is no such thing as sin. We shape our own realities, but what happens after that is the big picture. I/we don't need help for an imaginary being to live a good and fulfilling life. Indeed, compare your life and my life, and it'd probably come out roughly the same regarding happiness and sadness, or rewards and disappointments. That's life. Sorry that you can't see this. Good luck. You're right. There's lots of rich people who don't believe in god. I do see that. Like your religious view states though. I'm not striving to yield. I could not care if god makes me rich. I'll live this life poor. What is it going to bother me an already poor person? I'm looking to seek, not to yield.
I find the idea of Gods love laughable, talk to any depressed person and what pain they go through. If God truly cared he would empower good people to change things and that is saying the least he or it could do.
I would be a televangelist....but I have too much of a soul. (September 16, 2014 at 4:27 pm)Hellfire1014 Wrote: Nobody will burn in hell because hell doesn't exist. It's a fantasy. Must be why you're a member of every religion ever, huh? Oh, plus an infinite variety of imaginary religions. After all, you wouldn't want to take the chance on any of their hells, either. Oh, unless this statement is just a faux-rational cover for special pleading, that is. Quote: If I look at porn I'm satisfied with that, and do not seek out a relationship. Seems like a problem with you, not with porn. I met my fiancee on an erotica site, so evidently the active variable in you looking at porn and not getting into a relationship isn't the porn. Quote: If I look at porn in a relationship then I would not be fair to my wife. Depends very much on the particulars of your relationship, as it's entirely possible to foster a healthy marital sexuality with porn as a component. Again, this is a personal issue without anything to do with porn. Quote:Nothing wrong with the chakra stuff? Well how can people believe in some energy locations on the body, but not believe in god? It's actually very easy: just recognize the (obvious) fact that not all energy needs to come from god. Not that I do believe in chakras, just thought I'd point that out. Quote:Lots of problems with being gay. Stretched anus, diseases, anal fissures, hemeroids, what else? Fun fact: anal sex is not solely the domain of gay people, nor do all gay people have anal sex, nor is sex the only thing about being gay. You're really terrible at accurately attributing causes, dude.
"YOU take the hard look in the mirror. You are everything that is wrong with this world. The only thing important to you, is you." - ronedee
Want to see more of my writing? Check out my (safe for work!) site, Unprotected Sects! (September 16, 2014 at 3:00 pm)fr0d0 Wrote: Tldr. Even the religious bigotry you cite is not a result of religious teaching but of human failing. Do not give me that bullshit. It may slide with others, but certainly not me. Everything is considered human failing when it comes to us humans, because we are human. What makes the failing especially concerning is that it is backed by fallible religious notions. Stop the denial, hairy-footed one, because it is not doing you any services.
"Never trust a fox. Looks like a dog, behaves like a cat."
~ Erin Hunter |
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