Christians - What would you do if it were discovered Jesus never existed?

[Drich]

Dreams and empowerment is how God throughout the NT works.

Not to mention I only say 'dream' because I went to sleep in my bed and when the experience was over I woke up in the same place. Everything else about that experience plays out like any other waking memory. I've never had a 'dream' experience like this one.

I dream all sorts of weird crap, how on earth do you equate dreams with a message from god. Is he that impotent that his only way to send a message is through dreams that can't be verified by a third party?

Can you tell us some detail of this dream, you must have good recollection of such a life changing event. What form did the messenger take and what exactly was the basis of the message?

You'll be telling us you've seen his face in the bottom of your coffee cup next.

Answered in the Hell thread itself.

The 'dream' contained information I did not previously know about Hell. That and the 'dream' plays in memory like a memory and not a dream. Theirs nothing fuzzy or dream like about it. the memory is still sharp and very real. Again the only reason I call it a dream was because it began and ended while I was in bed.

[Drich]

It seems your the one confused. I clearly stated that if my knowledge of God was solely based on the tangable evidence and someone removed the tangable evidence then my belief would change. However since the tangable/written word is only apart of my belief system any change to the written word would not change what I have confirmed through personal experience.

Please don't remove this "tangable" evidence. Me likey.

[TubbyTubby]

I dream all sorts of weird crap, how on earth do you equate dreams with a message from god. Is he that impotent that his only way to send a message is through dreams that can't be verified by a third party?

Can you tell us some detail of this dream, you must have good recollection of such a life changing event. What form did the messenger take and what exactly was the basis of the message?

You'll be telling us you've seen his face in the bottom of your coffee cup next.

Answered in the Hell thread itself.

The 'dream' contained information I did not previously know about Hell. That and the 'dream' plays in memory like a memory and not a dream. Theirs nothing fuzzy or dream like about it. the memory is still sharp and very real. Again the only reason I call it a dream was because it began and ended while I was in bed.

So if you're not committing to call it a dream, what do you attribute it to?

[Drich]

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[hide]
Not to mention I only say 'dream' because I went to sleep in my bed and when the experience was over I woke up in the same place. Everything else about that experience plays out like any other waking memory. I've never had a 'dream' experience like this one.

And, again my experience is not 'proof' for you nor was it meant to be. It was for me. God however offers you exactly what you need to establish and maintain faith as well. Who knows if your lucky God will send you to Hell too!!

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Even the Bible says that a person shouldn't believe in dreams.

Sirach 34:1 CEB)
[ On dreams ] Senseless people have empty and false hopes, and dreams excite fools.

Sirach 34:2 (CEB)
Those who pay attention to dreams are just like people who grasp at a shadow or pursue the wind.

Sirach 34:5 (CEB)
Divinations, omens, and dreams are empty. The mind has fantasies, just like a woman in labor does.

Sirach 34:7 (CEB)
Dreams have misled many, and those who have placed hope in them have fallen.

To the Jew Sirach is a book of wisdom, to most Christians Sirach is a pepper/hot sauce.

Dreams/And visions are a 'Gift of the Holy Spirit.' If and Only if they do not conflict with what has already been said/written. acts 2:17 “ ‘And in the last days it shall be, God declares,
that I will pour out my Spirit on all flesh,
and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy,
and your young men shall see visions,
and your old men shall dream dreams

Point? The Whole book of Revelation was provided by a Dream/vision.
Joseph was told to take his new family and flee to Egypt in a dream.
plus a lot of OT examples.

From these examples we know God if He decides to uses dreams to communicate to us. But at the same time God is not the only one who uses dreams. We can tell the difference by taking that dream and holding next to scripture to determine whether it is God or Satan speaking to us in our dreams.

[rexbeccarox]

Please don't remove this "tangable" evidence. Me likey.

Yep! That's the idea!

[Drich]

Answered in the Hell thread itself.

The 'dream' contained information I did not previously know about Hell. That and the 'dream' plays in memory like a memory and not a dream. Theirs nothing fuzzy or dream like about it. the memory is still sharp and very real. Again the only reason I call it a dream was because it began and ended while I was in bed.

So if you're not committing to call it a dream, what do you attribute it to?

By the mechanical definition because I started out sleeping it is a dream. That is why I first identify it as a dream. However the content does not play out like any dream I have ever experienced. This dream or vision, put me before Christ on the day of my judgement. In my mind at the time I was there. Their was a feel a sense of presence that is absent in dreams.. It still plays out as real in my mind as what I did yesterday. But again when I woke up I felt like I fell into my bed, and bounced. so it ended as it began.. In my bed so to me that means dream by a very loose standard definition.

[Mr Greene]

If by 'data' you mean;
"Erm... well... Jerusalem exists!" 

BS, Verona exists, there's more evidence for the Capulets than any of the characters in the Jewish fantasy.

Like it or not the word 'data' simply means facts or other information used to reason out or plan something. This iscludes the bible.

Iscludes? Is an illiterate trying to argue literature with me?
The bible is the claim and therefore proof of sweet FA.
Documentary evidence is at best only a tertiary source and then when it isn't the claim in the first place, try rubbing 2 brain cells together.
The moment you apply any sort of qualitative assessment to the 'data' it evaporates in the most comprehensive manner I've ever come across.
Once the process is complete what you're left with is a succession of liars and con-men leaving a blood soaked trail across two and a half millennia...

[vorlon13]

It occurs to me there are quite a few Christian males that could be anally raped by Zeus and subsequently gestate an entire litter of demi-Gods, satyrs, goats, and unicorns, and still believe in Jesus.

[dyresand]

i highly doubt jesus existed for many reasosn. Also the fact said person "died" and came back to life is also very questionable.
I mean really he died and came back to life people back then never heard of weak pulse or shallow breath so the guy more than likely if he had
existed was pretty much alive so for those 3 days he was "dead" he was pretty fucked up and resting up then goes to his people talks to them
and leaves walking into desert to go fuck off.

[Kingpin]

i highly doubt jesus existed for many reasosn. Also the fact said person "died" and came back to life is also very questionable.
I mean really he died and came back to life people back then never heard of weak pulse or shallow breath so the guy more than likely if he had
existed was pretty much alive so for those 3 days he was "dead" he was pretty fucked up and resting up then goes to his people talks to them
and leaves walking into desert to go fuck off.

Do you really think the wounds he would have endured from the lashings and crucifixion would "recover" in three days time?  And how could he recover being sealed in a tomb alone for three days?  I don't see how you find that logical.  I know if I had a spear thrust in to my side and somehow lived and was locked in a cell alone for three days, not only would the hole still be there, but probably festered and infected and sure as hell wouldn't be able to walk around like all was well.