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RE: Is a religion based on human sacrifice moral and ethical?
January 5, 2012 at 6:33 am
(January 4, 2012 at 6:32 pm)padraic Wrote: Quote:Is a religion based on human sacrifice moral and ethical?
In context,of course it's moral.
Morality is relative,not absolute. It it is based on pragmatism,not some transcendent external authority.That's why morality varies depending on place and time.
Human sacrifice has been endemic throughout history,from Sumeria,to Meso America to ancient China and India. The reasons (especially the underlying function) can be simple or complex. Participants seem to always understand the gravity of the situation and have a logical rationale in context. (usually a syllogism,based on false premises*.like religious beliefs generally)
I guess it might be OK if we sacrificed the odd virgin, as long as the event was televised free to air. .
* by 'false' I mean 'unproven"
You would not mind then if your own innocent virgin daughter was killed so that criminals could go free without paying their own dues?
You would see that as good justice?
Regards
DL
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RE: Is a religion based on human sacrifice moral and ethical?
January 5, 2012 at 2:16 pm
(This post was last modified: January 5, 2012 at 2:22 pm by Godscreated.)
(January 5, 2012 at 6:03 am)KichigaiNeko Wrote: (January 5, 2012 at 6:00 am)Godschild Wrote: (January 5, 2012 at 5:32 am)KichigaiNeko Wrote: Your godboy was a scapegoat...these are wll known throughout history
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scapegoating
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/scapegoat
Sounds awfully like your godboy mate to me 
Doesn't at all sound like Jesus, no one made him a sacrifice he willingly went to the cross for the sake of mankind. Scapegoat has a negative connotation to it, everything Christ accomplished was positive.
Sorry pumpkin but it does...YOU may not want to see it but it is there for all to see.... Not interested in "negative or positive" just what IS
Taking out some of the facts (positive actions) you can make something look different than what it is. Man had nothing to do with the sacrifice of Jesus.
(January 5, 2012 at 6:05 am)Zen Badger Wrote: (January 5, 2012 at 6:00 am)Godschild Wrote: (January 5, 2012 at 5:32 am)KichigaiNeko Wrote:
Again I ask GC, where is the sacrifice???? what did jesus give up?
Only those who believe in what Christ has done for mankind can understand his sacrifice. So what good will it do me to explain something you can not understand, if you did understand you would be a christian.
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
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RE: Is a religion based on human sacrifice moral and ethical?
January 5, 2012 at 3:11 pm
A great hypocritical way of tucking your tail and running away.
You chastise and belittle without correction and that is just plain old cruelty.
A good Christian trait.
Regards
DL
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RE: Is a religion based on human sacrifice moral and ethical?
January 5, 2012 at 3:44 pm
(January 5, 2012 at 2:16 pm)Godschild Wrote: Only those who believe in what Christ has done for mankind can understand his sacrifice. So what good will it do me to explain something you can not understand, if you did understand you would be a christian.
In effect you said believing is its own justification.
Well, disbelieving has that that same precise justification, plus many others. So fuck off.
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RE: Is a religion based on human sacrifice moral and ethical?
January 5, 2012 at 6:44 pm
Quote:You would not mind then if your own innocent virgin daughter was killed so that criminals could go free without paying their own dues?
Oh for fuck sake! It was a joke you humourless git.
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Is a religion based on human sacrifice moral and ethical?
January 5, 2012 at 10:11 pm
(January 5, 2012 at 2:16 pm)Godschild Wrote: (January 5, 2012 at 6:03 am)KichigaiNeko Wrote: (January 5, 2012 at 6:00 am)Godschild Wrote: (January 5, 2012 at 5:32 am)KichigaiNeko Wrote: Your godboy was a scapegoat...these are wll known throughout history
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scapegoating
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/scapegoat
Sounds awfully like your godboy mate to me
Doesn't at all sound like Jesus, no one made him a sacrifice he willingly went to the cross for the sake of mankind. Scapegoat has a negative connotation to it, everything Christ accomplished was positive.
Sorry pumpkin but it does...YOU may not want to see it but it is there for all to see.... Not interested in "negative or positive" just what IS
Taking out some of the facts (positive actions) you can make something look different than what it is. Man had nothing to do with the sacrifice of Jesus.
(January 5, 2012 at 6:05 am)Zen Badger Wrote: (January 5, 2012 at 6:00 am)Godschild Wrote: (January 5, 2012 at 5:32 am)KichigaiNeko Wrote:
Again I ask GC, where is the sacrifice???? what did jesus give up?
Only those who believe in what Christ has done for mankind can understand his sacrifice. So what good will it do me to explain something you can not understand, if you did understand you would be a christian.
Well you give it your best shot and we'll see how we go
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If you're not supposed to ride faster than your guardian angel can fly then mine had better get a bloody SR-71.
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RE: Is a religion based on human sacrifice moral and ethical?
January 5, 2012 at 10:25 pm
Quote:Fr0d0 is correct, no human was or has ever been sacrificed to God.
Oh, wrong again, G-C. A pattern is developing here!
Quote:30 And Jephthah made a vow to the LORD: “If you give the Ammonites into my hands, 31 whatever comes out of the door of my house to meet me when I return in triumph from the Ammonites will be the LORD’s, and I will sacrifice it as a burnt offering.”
32 Then Jephthah went over to fight the Ammonites, and the LORD gave them into his hands. 33 He devastated twenty towns from Aroer to the vicinity of Minnith, as far as Abel Keramim. Thus Israel subdued Ammon.
34 When Jephthah returned to his home in Mizpah, who should come out to meet him but his daughter, dancing to the sound of timbrels! She was an only child. Except for her he had neither son nor daughter. 35 When he saw her, he tore his clothes and cried, “Oh no, my daughter! You have brought me down and I am devastated. I have made a vow to the LORD that I cannot break.”
36 “My father,” she replied, “you have given your word to the LORD. Do to me just as you promised, now that the LORD has avenged you of your enemies, the Ammonites. 37 But grant me this one request,” she said. “Give me two months to roam the hills and weep with my friends, because I will never marry.”
38 “You may go,” he said. And he let her go for two months. She and her friends went into the hills and wept because she would never marry. 39 After the two months, she returned to her father, and he did to her as he had vowed. And she was a virgin.
Unless, of course, you are willing to admit that this part of your "bible" is bullshit.
I'm really surprised by how little you know.
You should study more. You're letting the side down.
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RE: Is a religion based on human sacrifice moral and ethical?
January 6, 2012 at 3:15 am
(January 5, 2012 at 10:25 pm)Minimalist Wrote: Quote:Fr0d0 is correct, no human was or has ever been sacrificed to God.
Oh, wrong again, G-C. A pattern is developing here!
Quote:30 And Jephthah made a vow to the LORD: “If you give the Ammonites into my hands, 31 whatever comes out of the door of my house to meet me when I return in triumph from the Ammonites will be the LORD’s, and I will sacrifice it as a burnt offering.”
32 Then Jephthah went over to fight the Ammonites, and the LORD gave them into his hands. 33 He devastated twenty towns from Aroer to the vicinity of Minnith, as far as Abel Keramim. Thus Israel subdued Ammon.
34 When Jephthah returned to his home in Mizpah, who should come out to meet him but his daughter, dancing to the sound of timbrels! She was an only child. Except for her he had neither son nor daughter. 35 When he saw her, he tore his clothes and cried, “Oh no, my daughter! You have brought me down and I am devastated. I have made a vow to the LORD that I cannot break.”
36 “My father,” she replied, “you have given your word to the LORD. Do to me just as you promised, now that the LORD has avenged you of your enemies, the Ammonites. 37 But grant me this one request,” she said. “Give me two months to roam the hills and weep with my friends, because I will never marry.”
38 “You may go,” he said. And he let her go for two months. She and her friends went into the hills and wept because she would never marry. 39 After the two months, she returned to her father, and he did to her as he had vowed. And she was a virgin.
Unless, of course, you are willing to admit that this part of your "bible" is bullshit.
I'm really surprised by how little you know.
You should study more. You're letting the side down.
God did not ask for Japhthat to sacrifice his own daughter, that was of Japhthat's own doing. This is a discussion we recently had at church, though it was tied into Christ birth instead of his sacrifice.
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
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RE: Is a religion based on human sacrifice moral and ethical?
January 6, 2012 at 3:32 am
What has 'god' got to do with the price of beans. Your own book says that it happened. ( I, of course, regard your book as a fable so it is a pretty safe bet that none of this nonsense ever happened. )
The legal maxim is "Qui tacet consentire" [silence gives consent]. Where was your god popping out of the clouds to tell "Jeptha" that it was okay, he didn't have to barbeque his daughter? After all, you also think he played a practical joke on "Abraham" but stopped him at the last moment.
I really hate having to instruct you on your own book. Please go read the damn thing. And take your blinders off when you do.
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RE: Is a religion based on human sacrifice moral and ethical?
January 7, 2012 at 10:37 pm
Is a religion based on human sacrifice moral and ethical?
Why would it matter - religion is NOT the basis for ethics and morals to begin with. Statistics show that the more religious a country is - the HIGHER the crime rate - and the less religious a state is - the LOWER the crime rate is.
THe more fundamental your belief - the MORE likely you are to commit a crime - murder - commit suicide - have an abortion - and divorce.
WHY?
Because ethics and morals are largely based on education and intelligence levels - not religious beliefs. Non-believers are generally more highly educated than those fundamentalists who can be conned by religion.
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