Is Hellfire A Bible Teaching?

[Godscreated]

GC, it's not being done with cheap shots. If you said it before, staff missed it. Believe me, if we had seen it, you would have been warned earlier. We're not trying to drive you out. The idea is ridiculous. You were warned for something that is clearly stated in the rules.

OK.

[Drich]

ALTER2EGO -to- EVERYONE:

The teaching of hellfire is commonplace in Christendom and non-Christian religions. This teaching defames the Creator and portrays him as a sadist who tortures people in flames of fire for all eternity—as punishment for wrongdoing committed during the relatively brief human lifespan. The hellfire dogma was brought into Christianity by the Roman Catholics who copied it from pagan religions. (Pagans are those who do not worship the God of the Judeo-Christian Bible.)

The Bible makes it clear as to how God views the ritual burning of people. Jehovah ended up rejecting the ancient Israelites after they got involved with pagan worship, which included burning their children to death.

"And they [the Israelites/sons of Judah] have built the high places of Topheth, which is in the valley of the son of Hinnom, in order to burn their sons and their daughters in the fire, a thing that I had not commanded and that HAD NOT COME UP INTO MY HEART." (Jeremiah 7:31)


"{58} And they kept offending him with their high places, and with their graven images they kept inciting him to jealousy. {59} God heard and got to be furious, and he condemned Israel very much. {60} And he finally forsook the tabernacle of Shiloh, the tent in which he resided among earthling men."
(Psalms 78:58-60)


The scriptures indicate that hell is nothing more than mankind’s common grave. Proof of this is provided by a verse of scripture in the Bible, which no hellfire-believing Christian can explain away. I’m referring to the scripture that says Jesus Christ--the epitome of a perfect, sinless, and obedient man--died and went to hell.

"{21} In fact, to this course you were called, because even Christ suffered for you, leaving you a model for you to follow his steps closely. {22} He committed no sin, nor was deception found in his mouth." (1 Peter 2:21-22)


"He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that HIS SOUL WAS NOT LEFT IN HELL, neither his flesh did see corruption."
(Acts 2:31--King James Version)


NOTE #1: The Bible uses the word "fire" symbolically to indicate cleansing OR permanent death OR permanent destruction. In the few times when the Bible used the word "fire" literally, it was with reference to events such as the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah--at which point, the individuals did not suffer eternal torment, they died immediately.

NOTE #2: the words "Hell" and "Hades" and "Sheol" and "Pit" are synonyms that mean THE GRAVE (of mankind).

NOTE #3: In the Bible, the expression "the lake of fire" and the word "Gehenna" are figurative or symbolic language that refer to permanent death or permanent destruction.

NOTE #4: "High Places" as used in the scriptures that I quote in this thread refer to the worship of the false gods.


DISCUSSION QUESTIONS:
1. According to Jeremiah 7:31, did Jehovah command the ancient Israelites to burn anyone in the fire?

2. According to Jeremiah 7:31, did the burning of people come to God's heart?

3. According to Jeremiah 7:31 and Psalms 78:58-59, did the ancient Israelites offend God by getting involved with false worship in their "high places", which included burning people to death?

4. According to those who teach hellfire torment, hell is a place for people who are wicked and sinful. If Hellfire is for wicked people, why did Jesus spend three days in hell--considering that it says at 1 Peter 2:22 that he did not commit any sin?

5. Jesus obeyed Jehovah and died a slow and torturous death for mankind. Hadn't he suffered enough? He'd suffered terribly--because of being obedient to his Heavenly Father. So why was he being punished again with burning hellfire? What's the logic for punishing him all over again?

6. Recall that after Jesus' resurrection, he appeared and spoke to several of his faithful apostles on different occasions before he returned to heaven. Why is it that Jesus made no mention to any of his apostles--after his resurrection--that he went to hell where he burned for three days?

7. When people are being tortured in hellfire, wouldn't they have to KNOW or be conscious/aware of the fact that they are being burned? I mean to say, what's the point of punishing people in hell if they aren't even aware?

8. Those who believe in eternal torment say that the person's soul is being burned forever. What is the soul? Is it something separate from the person's body? Are animals souls also or is this only for humans?

The Jews Believe Hell or Sheol to be death/the Grave. They do not believe in a place of eternal torment. So all of you OT quotes would logically point to hell being the grave or pit.
Some do not believe in the resurection either. you get this life and that is it.

that said Christ had another take on Hell not consistent with traditional Jewish beliefs. (Matthew 25:41), “unquenchable fire” (Matthew 3:12), “shame and everlasting contempt” (Daniel 12:2), a place where “the fire is not quenched” (Mark 9:44-49), a place of “torment” and “fire” (Luke 16:23-24), “everlasting destruction” (2 Thessalonians 1:9), a place where “the smoke of torment rises forever and ever” (Revelation 14:10-11), and a “lake of burning sulfur” where the wicked are “tormented day and night forever and ever” (Revelation 20:10).

I used to be a burn in hell forever type of person but now i am not so sure, even so I know Hell is real and whatever the actual make up of it, it will not be a pleasent place, no matter how long you spend there.

[Neo-Scholastic]

The OP sounds very fishy to me. A new member named "Alter2Ego" carefully crafts a post like this? Most new members have a learning curve and don't start off with COLORED TEXT! Plus the post seems designed to hit all our hot buttons, combining literal and symbolic interpretations to lure believers into in-fighting. I'm not buying it.

[Godscreated]

@ Alter2Ego, if there is no hell then were is the punishment, where is the justice God promises.

ALTER2EGO -to- GODSCHILD:
I will let the Bible answer that for you.

"For the wages sin pays is death, but the gift God gives is everlasting life by Christ Jesus our Lord." (Romans 6:23)

QUESTION #1 to GODSCHILD: Did you see the two options at Romans 6:23?

QUESTION #2 to GODSCHILD: What is the opposite of life?


SUGGESTION: I encourage you to answer the 8 questions in my OP, then we will go from there.

#1) Those children were sacrificed to pagan gods, that's what outraged God. The manner of death is what the false religion calls fo, God would have been outraged at any manner of child sacrifice.

2#) God condones no murder.

3#) God was angry at their worship of other gods, and the practices that goes with them.

4#) 2nd Corinthians 5:21 God made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

5#) Who said Jesus was punished in hell.

6#)Why would He find a need to, there were many hings Jesus did not tell His disciples.

7#) Why wouldn't they be aware, God would not send them to punishment if they were not aware.

8#) Only humans have souls, and who said only souls would go to hell, the lost have their resurrection also, they will have physical bodies.

Matthew 25:41 "Then He (Jesus) will also say to those on His left,'Depart from Me, accursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels;
vv. 42-45 Jesus explains why.
Matthew 25:46 " And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."

The word eternal is used twice in verse 46 and both times it's the same Greek word. Thus their punishment is forever.

[Anomalocaris]

The OP sounds very fishy to me. A new member named "Alter2Ego" carefully crafts a post like this? Most new members have a learning curve and don't start off with COLORED TEXT! Plus the post seems designed to hit all our hot buttons, combining literal and symbolic interpretations to lure believers into in-fighting. I'm not buying it.

She ambarasses you?

[Alter2Ego]

Alter, I don't have the time to properly research your questions, so for the sake of what I want to ask I'll concede that they you are correct, at this point. With that being the case; are you saying that there is no hell, except for the separation from God kind? If I could bring Godschild in on this; GC, would you agree with that?

ALTER2EGO -to- GRINGO PERRY:
You don't have time to properly research my questions and so you will "concede" that I'm correct! Then I guess religious truth is not that important to you. Based on what you wrote above, you are setting yourself up to get conned into believing every false religious teaching that's presented to you.

I suggest you read my opening post carefully, and than answer the 8-question quiz that's at the end of it. The questions are based entirely on the scriptures in the OP. The quiz is intended to help people look for the answer in the Bible—as opposed to someone else telling them what to believe. So take the quiz, and then we will move to the next step. If you don't have time to do it now, just do it another day when you can find the time.


A WORD TO THE WISE: The worse thing you can do is let other people tell you what to believe—while you don't make the effort to search out the scriptures yourself. Without doing your own Bible reading and research, you are setting yourself up to get fooled by every trickster who comes along with his/her brand of religious philosophy. You need to draw your own logical conclusions based upon what's in the Bible.

The reason why there are over 33,000 denominations in Christendom—teaching people all types of falsehoods that are found nowhere in the Judeo-Christian Bible—is because people like to be spoon fed. They are intellectually lazy. They don't want to use their God-given logic and read and understand for themselves.

There's nothing wrong with asking someone to help you out by directing you to the scriptures that will answer your questions (assuming the person understands the Bible), but it's your responsibility to read those scriptures, pay attention to the context (the surrounding words, verses, and chapters) so that you get the correct understanding, and then reflect on what you've read to see if it makes sense. Take a lesson from the ancient Beroeans of whom the Bible says (and keep your eyes on the bolded text within the quotation):

"Now the latter were more noble-minded than those in Thessalonica, for they received the word with the greatest eagerness of mind, carefully examining the Scriptures daily as to whether these things were so." (Acts 17:11)

~***~

[Annik]

Hello, Pot? This is Kettle!

[Polaris]

The OP sounds very fishy to me. A new member named "Alter2Ego" carefully crafts a post like this? Most new members have a learning curve and don't start off with COLORED TEXT! Plus the post seems designed to hit all our hot buttons, combining literal and symbolic interpretations to lure believers into in-fighting. I'm not buying it.

This forum layout is very common on the internet. The php coding is the same across the board.

[Jackalope]

The OP sounds very fishy to me. A new member named "Alter2Ego" carefully crafts a post like this? Most new members have a learning curve and don't start off with COLORED TEXT! Plus the post seems designed to hit all our hot buttons, combining literal and symbolic interpretations to lure believers into in-fighting. I'm not buying it.

FWIW, the day she joined, she posted 3 or 4 similar threads. After a little investigation, it was discovered that she did the same thing across at least a dozen other boards. Same posts.

[Alter2Ego]

The OP sounds very fishy to me. A new member named "Alter2Ego" carefully crafts a post like this? Most new members have a learning curve and don't start off with COLORED TEXT! Plus the post seems designed to hit all our hot buttons, combining literal and symbolic interpretations to lure believers into in-fighting. I'm not buying it.

FWIW, the day she joined, she posted 3 or 4 similar threads. After a little investigation, it was discovered that she did the same thing across at least a dozen other boards. Same posts.

ALTER2EGO -to- CTHULHU DREAMING:
I participate at several other forums with the same topics that I personally typed and designed because people everywhere have the same issues. At some of the forums, the response is slow and so I rarely participate at those. At some forums where I'm registered, I don't participate at all. At the forums where I do participate, I respond to people one-on-one and address the particular issues they raise. If someone at another forum raises the identical issue, I will use the same response. But in many cases, the exchanges between me and people at various forums are so diverse that I will present entirely original responses.

In any event, what do you expect me to do? Confine myself to the same set of people at a couple of forums day in and day out? That might work for you. For me, it does not.