Fuck This "Xtian Nation" Shit!

[Minimalist]

All you A's do is take everything/anything I say, or anyone with a religion says and twist it up to suit your own dispositions at the moment.

Then stop saying stupid shit.

[Darkstar]

All you A's do is take everything/anything I say, or anyone with a religion says and twist it up to suit your own dispositions at the moment.

Wow, nice sweeping generalization...

It's rather childish, and boring to "assume" everyone who is a "believer" is a clone of your worst "Christian" nightmare. And vis-vis (OK?).

Just wondering, why are 'assume' and 'believer' in quotes? We don't assume that every believer is a clone of our worst christian the nightmare. However, it is a fact that with almost no exception, the less religious a nation is, the lower its crime rates are.

I pretty much knew this would happen from the get go. But I also thought I'd get good, engaging arguments on why there isn't a God. My observations (if I may do some twisting myself) is there are deep rooted reasons besides "I haven't seen a God lately", that makes you rely on your eyes and reasoning based on subtraction.

We didn't do any twisting. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morality_an..._and_crime
This doesn not prove that religion makes you less moral, but certainly doesn't go the other way.

No matter what you feel about God... Faith is still a part of EVERY person's life! Whether it's believing that our country will rebound, or the stockmarket, or our kid will do good in school, or that our faithfulness in our job, or careers will pay off someday.

Despite what other people have said, you are technically right. It takes a miniscule shred of faith to believe that the world won't end on the winter solstice this year, but it takes an enormous amount to believe it will. Without absolute knowledge, believing anyhting technically requires faith, just a negligible amount.

Not all of you have chimmed in, but most of you seem to think I'm just another religious zealot who's trying to thump you over the head with my bible. And with nothing to offer except more of the same.

Actually, the "religious zealot who's trying to thump" us "over the head with" his bible would be offering more of the same. If you are not this, then by all means, change the subject.

I'm understanding that you don't want to engage in anything that will refute what you have your mind set on. I guess I'm like that too.....BUT....with one big difference!

Err...no. We are perfectly willing to engage with something that will refute our mindset; we just haven't found it.

I'm unable to think that this is all there is to life! "Time" alone, and of itself proves there was indeed a beginning....and there will be an end! What preceeded that, and what will come after that are still a mystery to EVERYONE!

How is there something before the beginning and after the end? Books don't have a page -3. A prequel, maybe, but that is simply redefining where the beginning is.

[DeistPaladin]

In the WORLD Holmes!

So while they may self-identify as Christian, they aren't, in many cases, actually Christian, rather they follow a hybrid religion.

In fairness, Christianity is itself a hybrid religion, the maladjusted offspring of Judaism and Paganism that would grow up to try to kill off both parents.

So much for the fifth commandment.

[Faith No More]

And with nothing to offer except more of the same.

We can only go by what you post here, and so far everything you have said is more of the same. I for one would love to see you bring something new to the table.

[JohnDG]

However intolerant and infuriating christianity may be, it is still sad to see a people and entire way of life disappear. Often I am quite shocked by allot of the post on here, but I realize its for attention. I actually do attend church at least once every 2 months out of respect for my friend. Sometimes their pastor does have some inspirational things to say, sometimes he is right about modern day society corroding it's self. The only thing you can expect when all these theist are unplugged, are a bunch of scared hopeless people exposed to the harsh reality of the world. Most just are not ready for this truth people on AF can live with. This is reflected in the mainstream media which happens to be 50% porn which only encourages people to have sex with many partners, I'm not saying it is wrong just that it can be detrimental to society as a whole with the rapid spread of disease(1-4 people have std's *usa*). The constant appraisal of ignorance, stupidity vs education and knowledge. The reason religion has been main streem for so long is because it was necessary to keep those who haven't quite come out of their animalist nature in check. (jersey shore, badgirls club, law and order *for dumb people*, man vs food, celebrity ghost stories, I didn't know I was pregnant, I used to be fat, 1300 pnd virgin, E news.) I turned on the t.v. for about 30 seconds and that's what was on.

People learn more these days from video screens not books, I imagine most here read books, but the people you are talking about have really only read 1 book their entire life.

Now coupled with the fact that here in the USA a person will spend more of their time looking at a video screen than anything else in their life is very frightening indeed. Do you really want these people unplugged? Do you really want to see the difference between those who are rational of thought between those motivated by primal instincts?

[Cyberman]

I actually do attend church at least once every 2 months out of respect for my friend. Sometimes their pastor does have some inspirational things to say, sometimes he is right about modern day society corroding it's self.

I would contend that this is the primary raison d'être of religion: identify a problem (even where there isn't one) and then sell itself as the remedy. Combine the carrot of salvation with the stick of post-mortem torture and you have a surprisingly potent recruitment tool.

[JohnDG]

I actually do attend church at least once every 2 months out of respect for my friend. Sometimes their pastor does have some inspirational things to say, sometimes he is right about modern day society corroding it's self.

I would contend that this is the primary raison d'être of religion: identify a problem (even where there isn't one) and then sell itself as the remedy. Combine the carrot of salvation with the stick of post-mortem torture and you have a surprisingly potent recruitment tool.

So his logic can never be considered by an atheist because he is not one himself? He could never have a really good idea because he believes in god? He can not see youth destroying it's self through constant media bombardment lack of faith in one's self and consuming gmo foods? We talk all the time when I am there, I don't need to believe in god to understand what he talks about.

[Cyberman]

Is that what I said?

[JohnDG]

Is that what I said?

You might as well have, he has not tried to convert me or save me in any way, we only talk. Not everything he does will be centered on god, I have been to his sermons and haven't really seen him strike fear into anyone or threaten them with hell. He only mentioned the the decline of modern society because it created a deep sadness in him. Like what was mentioned before, the churches are shrinking, his church is down to 11 members and he pays most of the bills now out of his retirement and it is almost all gone. He won't be able to keep his church open, all he wants to do is preach at his church where he has been for over 20 years and pretty soon he won't be able to. I sympathize with the guy and respect him for being sincere about his situation and the fact he hasn't done any of the things you mentioned stimbo, at least from what I know.

[Darkstar]

So his logic can never be considered by an atheist because he is not one himself? He could never have a really good idea because he believes in god? He can not see youth destroying it's self through constant media bombardment lack of faith in one's self and consuming gmo foods? We talk all the time when I am there, I don't need to believe in god to understand what he talks about.

How are gmo foods dangerous? I admit that religion can do some good things, but a secular organization (minus not just god, but religious bigotry as well) could also do it. Sure, there are missionaries in Africa, but there is also the peace corps. Now, in terms of reasoning I agree that pastors can say good things from the pulpit, just that the good things they say are rarely related to religion, and the bad things (homophobia, etc.) rarely aren't.