Britain leaving the EU

[Creed of Heresy]

The EU wasn't exactly a fantastic idea. It was good in the short term but personally I can't help but think maybe it's long since served its purpose.

That or I, as an American, want to be a snarky dickhead and snicker and point and go "HA HA, EURO-BITCHES! WHO CAN STAY UNITED FOR MORE THAN TWO CENTURIES? WE CAN! WHO CAN'T STAY UNITED FOR TWO DECADES? YOU CAN'T! HA HA AMERICA ONE EUROPE ZERO! IN YOUR FACE!!

But that would be immature.

[Autumnlicious]

So dies the vision of a United States of Europe.

Good riddance. The US doesn't need a competitor, just small fry to bully.

Easier for us.

[Something completely different]

It was actualy initiated as a soly economical union without any kind of political ties.

The French and German economy should be so bound together and dependent of each other that the two nations would never go to war again (thereby dragging all of Europe with it) which is why it was founded by Germany and France.
After the Berlin wall fell, East and west Germany wanted to reunite, but France and Britain would only allow it if they would commit thesmselves in their constitution to the project of a political European union (which was then thought to be the best method of keeping Germany of becoming to powerfull).

Today, trade between France and Germany isnt that well and the political union had the reverse effect of making us richer and more powerfull.

[Tiberius]

"some people". Imagine someone entering a room with a few obece people in it and screaming "Some people are ugly fat basterds" to then defend himself by stating: No I didn`t mean you personaly.

Again, it was a general comment about perceived attitudes in the thread.

With this "some people" and your redicilous summery of "some peoples" opinion (which also happened to represent mine) in which you reworded it to be represented in as negative a light as possible, I felt that I had to respond, because it was simply disingenius.

I disagree with your claim of disingenuity and of re-wording, since I never actually quoted you, ergo I cannot possibly have reworded what you said. I was outlining what I saw as the attitudes in the thread; I backed them up in later back and forths.

In any case, did you not read my comment about bringing this up here? Don't. If you want to discuss what I said there, you can always PM me.

I will quote in future.

That wasn't the issue. Whether you quote or not is up to you, but don't just assume someone is talking to you when they make a response to one of your threads, especially if they haven't quoted you.

---

I did not say we wouldn't have anybody to trade with us but I'm not willing to engage in another one of your 'lets twist what he said debates'

You said we would be "nothing but a small floating island with no friends". Both the words "nothing but" and "no friends" imply an absence of trade, especially when you use it in the context of being an independent nation.

I'm not twisting what you said; I haven't done that before either (the matter I presume you speak of was one of the incorrect use of a word). I'm commenting on what your words seemed to convey. If that's not what you meant, perhaps you could explain what you did mean.

very interesting that you set up a website to debate with people yet you brand anyone who opposes your opinions as ridiculous.

I don't brand anyone who opposes my opinions as ridiculous. I only brand ideas as ridiculous when people espouse them. Note that I did not call you ridiculous (so you are twisting my words, how's that for irony), but rather branded your idea ridiculous.

P.S I have no issue with your belief we should leave the EU, it is a matter of personal view, mine is that we are better off in it.

Glad that you don't have an issue with my belief. I have an issue with yours in as much as I disagree with it and find your argument for it ridiculous.

[HorribleOffensiveScouser91]

In your first response to my earlier post you stated "To suggest nobody would trade with us if we left the EU is ridiculous" this seems to imply to me that you branded my argument ridiculous.

Furthermore, you just stated this "I have an issue with yours in as much as I disagree with it and find your argument for it ridiculous."

I never meant you branded people 'ridiculous' I meant that branding peoples opposing arguments 'ridiculous' on a debating forum is quite silly.

Would you please explain to me how you are NOT calling my argument, opinion or anything else ridiculous, when the statements I have quoted from you suggest otherwise?

If you're going to have a go at others from not expressing themselves properly you should do it properly yourself first. I'm not going to hang around in this thread to wait for your response of yet more contradictions and supposed 'corrections' .. good day.

[Something completely different]

Again, it was a general comment about perceived attitudes in the thread.


I disagree with your claim of disingenuity and of re-wording, since I never actually quoted you, ergo I cannot possibly have reworded what you said. I was outlining what I saw as the attitudes in the thread; I backed them up in later back and forths.

In any case, did you not read my comment about bringing this up here? Don't. If you want to discuss what I said there, you can always PM me.


That wasn't the issue. Whether you quote or not is up to you, but don't just assume someone is talking to you when they make a response to one of your threads, especially if they haven't quoted you.

And one does not simply assume that one has the capacities to express someones opnions for someone, for whatever reason one may believe that that person is originaly not capable of expressing his or her opinion. Which was clearly the case in the example I gave.
And even if it was not directed at me, I can still respond, if I feel if I have the arguments to.

The issue here was quoting.

[fr0d0]

Good posts TGAC

I don't think the UK is much of a force on Europe at all. Germany is the financial backbone without a doubt. Damn those southerners ruining it.

Like you said, I think the Union was supposed to be more financial than anything else, and that seems to be the point most Brits have a problem with. Cameron realises the importance financially. I really can't understand why he would undermine our position like this. It just gives the bigoted skinheads some more followers.
Some people here in the UK think that stopping immigration to an island that is pretty much 99% immigrant origin, and living off a distant dream of empire will put food on the table. We have to be part of the world and we need to get on with that.

[Napoléon]

The EU is quite funny really. For years we fought wars to stop the Germans running europe, yet now we owe them all money and they're running it anyway...

[Something completely different]

The EU is quite funny really. For years we fought wars to stop the Germans running europe, yet now we owe them all money and they're running it anyway...

We aren`t running it.

If you would watch our parlament and understand German, nothing sounds scarier to us.
Which is why we compromised so much at the austerity messures negotiated with France for Greece.

[Napoléon]

I was joking...