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Any questions on Islam?
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 RE: Any questions on Islam?
March 10, 2013 at 9:16 pm
(This post was last modified: March 10, 2013 at 9:18 pm by ideologue08.)
Let's put it this way, if god even showed up to the debate, he would win by default. Existing doesn't seem to mean much to him.
John Adams Wrote:The Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion.  (March 10, 2013 at 9:05 pm)mo66 Wrote:(March 10, 2013 at 9:01 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: Riddle me this Batman!Those who desire both this world and heaven will get it in general, as the Qur'an states (if they believe in God and His messengers etc.)However, every person has their own specific situation. Desiring this world (dw) Desiring next world (dn) Paradise (p) Only Hell (h) dw -> h dn -> p h -> not p dw and dn -> p and h dw and dn -> p and not p p and not p contradict. Therefore you have a contradiction. You can't both be promised nothing but hell fire in the next world and at the same time promised paradise. You are then promised not to go to paradise and to go to paradise. This is simple logic. (March 10, 2013 at 9:28 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:Are you kidding me? Look, I don't mean to be insulting but I'm not from the Mu'tazilah or the kalamiyoon.(March 10, 2013 at 9:05 pm)mo66 Wrote: Those who desire both this world and heaven will get it in general, as the Qur'an states (if they believe in God and His messengers etc.)However, every person has their own specific situation. If we could figure everything out using logic, there would ne absolutely no need for Divine revelation. It's BECAUSE logic alone cannot get us to heaven, we need Divine revelation. Applying human to Divinely revealed text does not work at such a theological level as you have displayed. I don't have the time to provide full refutation today but I fear our discussion will be like the famous argument between Ar-razi and Ibn Taymiyyah! To summarise, if you are a Qur'anic literalist as I am (as most Muslims are), there is nothing logically inconsistent with believing in the wording as it came (I assume you are reffering to the verses in chapter 2? Your scenarios don't really make sense tbh... It's about what your pre-conceived beliefs are.
Whenever you read language, you are applying logic. To understand what Quran is saying you are making logical statements.
In the case of Quran, in three verses it promises those who desire the life of this world to have no share of the hereafter rather nothing but the hell fire. It also promises those who desire the next world to be given from it. Simple logic shows it's a contradiction. Also, the Quran says if it was from other then God, we would find it many contradictions. I disagree with this statement, but, it seems rather unfair that if we do find contradictions, it's stated we can't apply human logic. And we don't find contradictions, it's stated then it must be divine. Catch 20/20! 
Hate to tell you this Mystic, but I have it on good authority that he isn't gonna come back
 I however am interested in your logic analysis. Bear with me as I am surely not a logical girl. Nor a math prodigy. Or even a math interested kinda girl. -> means greater than or equal to in your terminology? 
If I were to create self aware beings knowing fully what they would do in their lifetimes, I sure wouldn't create a HELL for the majority of them to live in infinitely! That's not Love, that's sadistic. Therefore a truly loving god does not exist!
Quote:The sin is against an infinite being (God) unforgiven infinitely, therefore the punishment is infinite. Dead wrong. The actions of a finite being measured against an infinite one are infinitesimal and therefore merit infinitesimal punishment. Quote:Some people deserve hell. I say again: No exceptions. Punishment should be equal to the crime, not in excess of it. As soon as the punishment is greater than the crime, the punisher is in the wrong. ![[Image: tumblr_n1j4lmACk61qchtw3o1_500.gif]](https://66.media.tumblr.com/5fb74c6d16622fb3dbb358509c9aec03/tumblr_n1j4lmACk61qchtw3o1_500.gif)
  (March 1, 2013 at 8:59 am)Aractus Wrote: At any time in the Bible does God ever send a prophet that knows an exclusive truth that's hidden from everybody else? Of course not. Prove god is real before telling everyone that he wouldn't do irrational or illogical things.
You are currently experiencing a lucky and very brief window of awareness, sandwiched in between two periods of timeless and utter nothingness. So why not make the most of it, and stop wasting your life away trying to convince other people that there is something else? The reality is obvious.
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