I have always doubted the existence of a god or gods, but recently have seen more than before than it makes sense that there is no god. I do however, have problems with one thing: the acknowledgement of my grandfather to having seen angels just before both my mother and his sister dying. Is there a solid argument for why seeing angels is a delusion? (he was illiterate, believed in god, and went to church while living a simple life as a carpenter)
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Current time: February 27, 2025, 7:17 pm
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atheist argument against the widespread witness of angels
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Because angels don't exist?
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe." -Einstein
 (March 27, 2013 at 2:16 pm)samiam2013 Wrote: the acknowledgement of my grandfather to having seen angels just before both my mother and his sister dying. Is there a solid argument for why seeing angels is a delusion? (he was illiterate, believed in god, and went to church while living a simple life as a carpenter) Why do people claim to see Sasqutch? Why do people claim to see a chupacabra? Humans are susceptible to delusion and easily fooled. Always have been, so knowing this, we have developed methods to determine truth - observation, evidence, repeatability. Works great for the most part.  (March 27, 2013 at 2:16 pm)samiam2013 Wrote: I have always doubted the existence of a god or gods, but recently have seen more than before than it makes sense that there is no god. I do however, have problems with one thing: the acknowledgement of my grandfather to having seen angels just before both my mother and his sister dying. Is there a solid argument for why seeing angels is a delusion? (he was illiterate, believed in god, and went to church while living a simple life as a carpenter) Well we can't know for sure what he saw because we weren't there and so aren't privy to the facts. It could've been a trick of the light, a small swarm of midges (an explanation for some sightings of a nun over a drain in a nunnery turned out to be this), wishfull thinking or just plain drugs. I doubt very much that it was angels, almost anything is more likely. You can fix ignorance, you can't fix stupid. Tinkety Tonk and down with the Nazis. 
How does "my grandfather says he saw angels" equate to "the widespread witness of angels"?
"Well, evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts. Facts don't go away when scientists debate rival theories to explain them. Einstein's theory of gravitation replaced Newton's in this century, but apples didn't suspend themselves in midair, pending the outcome. And humans evolved from ape- like ancestors whether they did so by Darwin's proposed mechanism or by some other yet to be discovered."
-Stephen Jay Gould 
Because.....
Quote:Men willingly believe what they wish. 
There are plenty of real angels, from the baseball team in Anaheim to those employed by Charles Townsend.
The angels from the Bible are, of course, as real as orcs, goblins and the Balrog. 
Comparing the Universal Oneness of All Life to Yo Mama since 2010.
![[Image: harmlesskitchen.png]](https://i.postimg.cc/yxR97P23/harmlesskitchen.png) I was born with the gift of laughter and a sense the world is mad. 
The human mind is quite easy to fool.
Put a person under the duress of a loved one dying, and you have the perfect mental environment for seeing something that is not there, or misinterpreting something that is there. Especially with a believer. It's called 'confirmation bias'. You'd believe if you just opened your heart" is a terrible argument for religion. It's basically saying, "If you bias yourself enough, you can convince yourself that this is true." If religion were true, people wouldn't need faith to believe it -- it would be supported by good evidence.
I suspect it was more like this....
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe." -Einstein
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