Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: March 29, 2024, 6:37 am

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
How do I get over that "feeling" that god exists?
#31
RE: How do I get over that "feeling" that god exists?
(April 20, 2015 at 9:48 am)robvalue Wrote: A quid for a sandwich?
So you use squid as money in the UK? Brits are odd. Tongue
It is very important not to mistake hemlock for parsley, but to believe or not believe in God is not important at all. - Denis Diderot

We are the United States of Amnesia, we learn nothing because we remember nothing. - Gore Vidal
Reply
#32
RE: How do I get over that "feeling" that god exists?
(April 14, 2015 at 8:54 pm)IanHulett Wrote: I'm still technically a recent deconvert, only becoming an atheist in mid january of this year, but I still have this persistent "feeling" that God exists even though I know it's a lie, but it's also followed by a fear that everything I do will lead to me burning in hell, even though I know it's all fake, and it's been 3 months. I have been around so many conservative religious people who kept telling me I'm going to burn in hell, over and over again, throughout my childhood, and add to that the whole concept of hell in Christianity, also all the bad stuff that's been done in the name of religion, basically, I cannot get over this "feeling" or fear and I don't know what else to do. I'm not going back to religion... well... not without evidence, and I don't want this fear or "feeling" to run my life.

Is it possible that the reason this is still happening is because my former religion has been traumatic for me? Or is this normal because it's only been 3 months? How do I get rid of this "feeling" and fear? Will it disappear with time? Thanks a bunch.

Belief in God (theism) isn't a religion. Its an opinion we owe our existence to a personal agent who purposely created the universe and caused humans to exist. There is no religious connotation but it does have philosophical ramifications. For instance it gives reason to believe humans are special and created equal as opposed to the idea humans are the untended by product of the laws of physics and thus our existence is an accident.
Reply
#33
RE: How do I get over that "feeling" that god exists?
That's not what theism is as I've pointed out before.

It's a belief in a god, nothing more.

I could quite happily believe in God but tell him to suck my dick.
Feel free to send me a private message.
Please visit my website here! It's got lots of information about atheism/theism and support for new atheists.

Index of useful threads and discussions
Index of my best videos
Quickstart guide to the forum
Reply
#34
RE: How do I get over that "feeling" that god exists?
(April 20, 2015 at 1:00 pm)Drew_2013 Wrote: Belief in God (theism) isn't a religion. Its an opinion we owe our existence to a personal agent who purposely created the universe and caused humans to exist. There is no religious connotation but it does have philosophical ramifications. For instance it gives reason to believe humans are special and created equal as opposed to the idea humans are the untended by product of the laws of physics and thus our existence is an accident.

There are at least 200 billion galaxies, each with at least 100 billion stars. So far, astronomers have discovered almost 2000 planets orbiting other stars in our galaxy just in our 'neighborhood', about 22% of them are in the habitable zone.

The same molecules that are part of life on Earth, seem to be elsewhere in the universe. The same laws of physics and chemistry are the same elsewhere in the universe. 

It is almost a certainty that other intelligent life exists in the universe. We are not special, we are not some pinnacle of 'creation', nor are we an 'accident' in the way you use the term.  

You'd believe if you just opened your heart" is a terrible argument for religion. It's basically saying, "If you bias yourself enough, you can convince yourself that this is true." If religion were true, people wouldn't need faith to believe it -- it would be supported by good evidence.
Reply
#35
RE: How do I get over that "feeling" that god exists?
(April 21, 2015 at 1:58 pm)Simon Moon Wrote:
(April 20, 2015 at 1:00 pm)Drew_2013 Wrote: Belief in God (theism) isn't a religion. Its an opinion we owe our existence to a personal agent who purposely created the universe and caused humans to exist. There is no religious connotation but it does have philosophical ramifications. For instance it gives reason to believe humans are special and created equal as opposed to the idea humans are the untended by product of the laws of physics and thus our existence is an accident.

There are at least 200 billion galaxies, each with at least 100 billion stars. So far, astronomers have discovered almost 2000 planets orbiting other stars in our galaxy just in our 'neighborhood', about 22% of them are in the habitable zone.

The same molecules that are part of life on Earth, seem to be elsewhere in the universe. The same laws of physics and chemistry are the same elsewhere in the universe. 

It is almost a certainty that other intelligent life exists in the universe. We are not special, we are not some pinnacle of 'creation', nor are we an 'accident' in the way you use the term.  

I didn't write that humans are special because we're the only intelligent beings in existence, that's an argument you're making. Whether we're the only intelligent beings in the universe or the universe is teeming with intelligent beings if we're the result of a Creator who made the universe for the benefit of intelligent beings then we have reason to think humans are special. If on the other hand humans are the unintended by product of mindless forces then we're no more special than anything else that was unintentionally created. How would you describe the cause of our existence if it wasn't intentional? Isn't an accident by definition something that unintentionally happens to happen?
Reply
#36
RE: How do I get over that "feeling" that god exists?
(April 14, 2015 at 8:54 pm)IanHulett Wrote: Is it possible that the reason this is still happening is because my former religion has been traumatic for me? Or is this normal because it's only been 3 months? How do I get rid of this "feeling" and fear? Will it disappear with time? Thanks a bunch.

It took me a year-and-a-half, or so, to go from being a believer with doubts to a full-out nonbeliever. Even then, it took me another six months to get comfortable with that. During that time, I couldn't really admit to myself that I didn't believe, and I was afraid I was wrong and might be failing a test.

Realize that both that you are changing an important, fundamental aspect of yourself and that it will take time. Try to frame things more in terms of rational thought more than emotional feelings. A lot of theistic arguments are made from the basis of emotion. The thought I remember having when I finally came to terms with my atheism and grew comfortable with it was when I realized that I never lost any sleep over not being Muslim or believing in the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Christianity doesn't bring any more evidence to the table than those religions, yet I was super worried about it and not the others.

I'm not saying that will do the trick for you, but give it time. Also, if you can find a support group of like-minded friends, that helps a lot.
Reply
#37
RE: How do I get over that "feeling" that god exists?
(April 20, 2015 at 1:00 pm)Drew_2013 Wrote: Belief in God (theism) isn't a religion. Its an opinion we owe our existence to a personal agent who purposely created the universe and caused humans to exist. There is no religious connotation but it does have philosophical ramifications. For instance it gives reason to believe humans are special and created equal as opposed to the idea humans are the untended by product of the laws of physics and thus our existence is an accident.

There is actually a 'feeling' that an agent personal specifically to you created everything, humans included? Really?

Break that down for me. I can understand if you say you feel gratitude to something for bringing you and this world together. After all, something did put you together. There was an inborn wisdom in the proto-organism which became you which read the DNA and assembled you accordingly in the womb. In so doing, it created the link to experiencing the world around you which continued to come into focus as you matured after birth. Something there is which brings you and the world together in your experience which functioned before you were you. So be thankful, sure. Wouldn't be here otherwise, right?

But aren't you piling a lot onto that feeling if you say 'this personal agent' actually brought everything into being? What sort of feeling could possibly include all that? If it is really 'personal' why not limit your inference to just you? This personal agent which created the ground of your being may be common to the 'personal agents' which create the ground of being for every creature that experiences anything at all, but it doesn't have to be one centralized personal agent which connects to each creature. There may just be a process we don't completely understand by which some agency forms and then transforms until we are as we find ourselves. Just as in the study of embryology, we see our physical form undergo recognizable forms on the way to what we finally become, so our consciousness too may morph as we mature. Perhaps 'god' is just an early stage of our consciousness which is transitional to the selves we become. God doesn't need to be a centralized, top down operation.
Reply
#38
RE: How do I get over that "feeling" that god exists?
(April 24, 2015 at 7:38 pm)whateverist Wrote:
(April 20, 2015 at 1:00 pm)Drew_2013 Wrote: Belief in God (theism) isn't a religion. Its an opinion we owe our existence to a personal agent who purposely created the universe and caused humans to exist. There is no religious connotation but it does have philosophical ramifications. For instance it gives reason to believe humans are special and created equal as opposed to the idea humans are the untended by product of the laws of physics and thus our existence is an accident.

There is actually a 'feeling' that an agent personal specifically to you created everything, humans included?  Really?

Its not a feeling, its an opinion based on facts, data and observation. I have an opinion that OJ Simpson murdered two people. I don't have a feeling he did it I have a belief based on the available evidence. I can't be sure he did...no one can.
Reply
#39
RE: How do I get over that "feeling" that god exists?
(April 24, 2015 at 7:46 pm)Drew_2013 Wrote:
(April 24, 2015 at 7:38 pm)whateverist Wrote: There is actually a 'feeling' that an agent personal specifically to you created everything, humans included?  Really?

Its not a feeling, its an opinion based on facts, data and observation. I have an opinion that OJ Simpson murdered two people. I don't have a feeling he did it I have a belief based on the available evidence. I can't be sure he did...no one can.

Um no sorry. The feeling of a god existing is you wanting to have a super hero. No god claim was around 200,000 years ago, nor 4 billion years ago nor 13 billion years ago, and when our planet dies there will be no record of any life on this planet or our species or the gods we invented.

We have evidence of OJ and his victims existing, there is absolutely no evidence of a god outside the the evidence humans make up god claims.

Pick a god you know does not exist you have heard claimed before, take that god and replace the one you currently hold in this argument with one you rightfully reject and see if this logic still works.

Does Allah work as the inventor and we are the product?
Does Yahweh work as the inventor and we are the product?
Does Vishnu work for you as the inventor and we are the product?

I think it makes much more sense that humans invent gods because they like the idea of having a hero.
Reply
#40
RE: How do I get over that "feeling" that god exists?
(April 14, 2015 at 8:54 pm)IanHulett Wrote: I'm still technically a recent deconvert, only becoming an atheist in mid january of this year, but I still have this persistent "feeling" that God exists even though I know it's a lie, but it's also followed by a fear that everything I do will lead to me burning in hell, even though I know it's all fake, and it's been 3 months. I have been around so many conservative religious people who kept telling me I'm going to burn in hell, over and over again, throughout my childhood, and add to that the whole concept of hell in Christianity, also all the bad stuff that's been done in the name of religion, basically, I cannot get over this "feeling" or fear and I don't know what else to do. I'm not going back to religion... well... not without evidence, and I don't want this fear or "feeling" to run my life.

Is it possible that the reason this is still happening is because my former religion has been traumatic for me? Or is this normal because it's only been 3 months? How do I get rid of this "feeling" and fear? Will it disappear with time? Thanks a bunch.

Don't try so hard. Follow the evidence wherever you believe it leads, and like the physicist Julian Barbour's father told him as a young boy, "Never believe anything anyone ever tells you without checking again and again." If you feel like you need to believe in something like a deity, whether it just creates and then lets the clock tick, or sits and waits for a little cesspool to spawn ungrateful bipeds so that it can be worshipped and judge its little toys on the basis of their natures and environments, go for it. You might find yourself embarrassed to admit as much when you're asked to give a rational account, but if you're sincerely struggling without the higher power concept, that's more important. You'll find better and worse reasons to believe on different days, and so long as you're not a disingenuous douchebag spouting some hateful dogma that you believe on the basis of private, infallible attestation to the One True Creed, I think people can respect that. 
He who loves God cannot endeavour that God should love him in return - Baruch Spinoza
Reply



Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Why did God get such a makeover in the New Testament? Hi600 10 1493 April 1, 2023 at 4:48 am
Last Post: Goosebump
  How do I deal with the belief that maybe... Just maybe... God exists and I'm... Gentle_Idiot 75 5946 November 23, 2022 at 5:34 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  God Exists brokenreflector 210 12450 June 16, 2020 at 1:19 pm
Last Post: Gawdzilla Sama
  "How do I know God exists?" - the first step to atheism Mystic 51 29550 April 23, 2018 at 8:44 pm
Last Post: Edwardo Piet
  Before We Discuss Whether God Exists, I Have A Question Jenny A 113 14585 March 7, 2018 at 5:27 pm
Last Post: possibletarian
  Proof that God exists TheoneandonlytrueGod 203 46293 January 23, 2018 at 11:48 pm
Last Post: vulcanlogician
  Muslims are using this NASA video as proof that islam is true and that allah exists LetThereBeNoGod 10 3887 February 16, 2017 at 9:32 pm
Last Post: LetThereBeNoGod
  Feeling frustrated mageta52 7 1560 May 6, 2016 at 9:41 pm
Last Post: Sterben
  "If God Exists" -Darkmatter25's newest vid Simon Moon 38 7996 December 29, 2015 at 2:52 pm
Last Post: Brakeman
  How Do You Get Over Death? Shuffle 124 25447 September 2, 2015 at 11:37 pm
Last Post: Shuffle



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)