JUST OPEN YOUR HEART, DAMMIT!

[ronedee]

Spiritual is instantaneous due to the fact that you can make it up as you go along.

But that "little voice" is seldom wrong!

[Salacious B. Crumb]

If more people read the Bible with their minds and not their hearts, Christianity would die out. Actually, all religions would die out if people applied logic to the reading of their 'holy books.'

If you don't think you have a soul, then you don't. Simple. Scripture is useless to you.

But, I believe I do have a "soul"! So then, the scripture means something to me.

Now, I'm not going to catholic hell. Yaaaaayyyyy! I simply don't believe in a soul, therefore I don't have one.

So, if you believe something, it automatically makes it true? Interesting logic.. There's people out there that believe in souls, and that ridiculous bible is useless to them.

[ronedee]

If you don't think you have a soul, then you don't. Simple. Scripture is useless to you.

But, I believe I do have a "soul"! So then, the scripture means something to me.

Now, I'm not going to catholic hell. Yaaaaayyyyy! I simply don't believe in a soul, therefore I don't have one.

So, if you believe something, it automatically makes it true? Interesting logic.. There's people out there that believe in souls, and that ridiculous bible is useless to them.

You took my metaphor too seriously. I should've used a famous quote: "I think, therefore I am".... that better 4 ya?

[Athene]

This seems like a bit of a cop out to me. Would anyone need to resort to reading the Bible with an open heart (and love) to believe that the Bible is the word God, if is in fact the Truth? I don't see why someone would need to rely on heart bursting with desire and love to get there....after all, this is Truth we're talking about. Are you certain "with an open heart" doesn't also mean "no reasoning or critical thinking"? That one has to get into the Bible with nothing but warm fuzzies in order to believe it?

No... but if you read the bible using logic, will it make any sense to you? I dunno?

Personally, several things had to happen first, for me for the bible to make any sense. I did indeed ask with an open heart. I did get answers, but also more questions. Its definitely a process that needs to be followed. But, w/o a true desire to know? I don't believe its possible. I had to examine my life. I needed more than what met the eye. Or the mind! But, that's not to say I haven't used logic. I have. And I was able to connect the mind and spirit. But also, its my own path. We need to find that individual path to God. And our own answers.

Oh, I didn't realize that there are several things that have to happen first. I'm glad that you made it clear that it's a process....examination, the eye, the mind, the spirit, the path AND reading with an open heart...plus desire. And love. Can you imagine if people had to go through this process to recognize the truth in any other matter? It would be exhausting, wouldn't it?

[Athene]

Spiritual is instantaneous due to the fact that you can make it up as you go along.

But that "little voice" is seldom wrong!

I know, right? That's the bestest part of getting to make things up.....you can just change the attributes of the "spirit" and then you're right! I mean, no one's ever actually seen the "spirit", so it can be whatever you want it to be!

[Salacious B. Crumb]

Now, I'm not going to catholic hell. Yaaaaayyyyy! I simply don't believe in a soul, therefore I don't have one.

So, if you believe something, it automatically makes it true? Interesting logic.. There's people out there that believe in souls, and that ridiculous bible is useless to them.

You took my metaphor too seriously. I should've used a famous quote: "I think, therefore I am".... that better 4 ya?

I don't think that applies to your argument. Here was the next two lines of that quote: "Its just like looking at art; Some are moved to emotion. Some are moved to the restroom. Do we know why this happens? No. We just shake [our] heads and strongly feel the other is... well... less than tasteful about their choices."

It seems that you're suggesting that all people interpret or perceive things in a different way. I don't see how a literal word of god, is to be taken metaphorically. I can't take the beating of slaves verse of the bible, and say that that's meant to be taken metaphorically, when it clearly isn't meant to be taken that way. I could simply choose to believe the bible as I'm reading it, but that's not logical. If I did that with everything that I read, then nothing would make sense. Everything would contradict each other, and I'd be living in fairy tale land. If I decided to read the vedas in that way as well, which one am I supposed to believe? Both of them? No, it's best to read books that have extraordinary claims attached to them, with a skeptical mindset, especially when there is no evidence that the jesus story took place, and no evidence that any of those miracles could actually occur in reality.

And, sorry, I'm too good at taking the biblical "metaphors" literally. I don't think "metaphors" that are misogynistic in nature, are good metaphors to have in a book that supposedly came from, or was inspired by god. As you say, it makes me shake my head, or moves me to the restroom, because those biblical metaphors are pure shit.

[Nope]

Emotions may be faster, but the mind has a better track record in the long term.

... meanwhile the building collapses!

To me, metaphors should make sense so I am going to work yours out

Chad says that the in the long term it is better to use intellect to figure out truth. You respond that the building will collapse. I guess that I don't understand how your response makes sense in context to his. Do you think that people who use their minds to find the truth work slower than someone who goes by emotions?

[Chad32]

Emotions may be faster, but the mind has a better track record in the long term.

... meanwhile the building collapses!

Come again?

[surreptitious57]

I have no problem in principle with the non religiosity of the Sermon On The Mount or The Parables or
Commandments four to eight. And that is because they reference basic human values and as such are
not the exclusive preserve of Christians. For you do not have to be one in order to forgive your enemy
or help a stranger or not tell lies. For these are things any one can do regardless of their belief system
Christians sometimes do not understand how atheists can be moral without God but morality is rooted
in psychology not in religion. So all religion does is superfluously reinforce it for its own ulterior motive

A MIND IS LIKE A PARACHUTE : IT DOES NOT WORK UNLESS IT IS OPEN

[abaris]

Its not about the "mind". Its about the spirit. If you don't think you have a soul, then you don't. Simple. Scripture is useless to you.

But, I believe I do have a "soul"! So then, the scripture means something to me.

For the longest time of my life I believed to have a soul, but scripture didn't do anything for me. As a child it sometimes frightened me. Especially when the priests thought they had to put some fear into our little selves. Later on it seemed illogical, badly written and boring.

I think, besides believing to have a soul, you also have to be certain to find your answers there, in that very book. You have to be convinced before opening it. Kind of a self fullfilling prophecy. I've seen so many christians, who bend and shape their bible verses to fit their individual needs. They also do their bending and shaping with Jesus, who can either be warrior Jeez or some kind of archaic hippie. I've seen and heard both.