What's the most face-palm-worthy statement you have ever heard from a priest/preacher

[Randy Carson]

There are 1.2 billion of us Catholics, Parkers. Have we all enabled molesters?

Parker didn't say that - if you actually read his post - and I wouldn't say that. One of the reasons being that right at my doorstep there's a grassroot organisation called "Wir sind Kirche" (We are the church). While I don't agree with them on their religious beliefs, I have nothing but the utmost respect for them. Consisting lay members as well as priests of the Catholic church. They are fighting the good fight. For gay rights and marriage, against religious bigotry and against brushing abuse under the carpet.

Without assuming to speak for Parker - what we have a problem with is the hierarchy brushing abuse under the carpet for decades. They now reap what they sowed - a massive fallout.

You'll get no argument from me on that.

But regarding "Wir sind Kirche", they advocate gay marriage and women priests...and one of their founders has been excommunicated. So, no, they are NOT the Church. At least, not the one founded by Jesus 2,000 years ago.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/We_Are_Church

[abaris]

But regarding "Wir sind Kirche", they advocate gay marriage and women priests...and one of their founders has been excommunicated. So, no, they are NOT the Church. At least, not the one founded by Jesus 2,000 years ago.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/We_Are_Church

They're not the church Rome advocates. The Jesus part is only what Rome says to be the Jesus part. But that makes them a grassroot organisation. Excommunicate them as much as you like. They stick with their believes and their values. That's one thing I admire, without sharing their believes, since change can only come from within the system.

It speaks volumes that those persons who I personally admire for their humanitarian values, are also the ones shunned by the system. Such as Helmut Schüller.

[Randy Carson]

It speaks volumes that those persons who I personally admire for their humanitarian values, are also the ones shunned by the system. Such as Helmut Schüller.

And it speaks volumes that you admire persons "shunned by the system".

[Thumpalumpacus]

There are 1.2 billion of us Catholics, Parkers. Have we all enabled molesters?

If they have donated money, yes.

If so, can you explain how we did this exactly? Did most of us even know it was occurring back in the 1950's, 1960's, 1970's, etc?

You can enable something without knowing about it, but let's be honest, it was clear at least ast far back as the 80s, in my adolescence, that priests were molesting children. I certainly read about it in my newspapers.

If you didn't vet the recipient of your donation, well, that's on you. When I give money to someone, I take the time to know that it isn't going to support things I don't like.

However -- this is the 2010s, and you are still donating. Why is that? Don't you feel bad for continuing to support an organization which as recently as six months ago sought to deny full recompense to its victims?

Me, I would be ashamed of donating to such people. Your mileage clearly varies ... but I do believe it's lower than you imagine.

[Randy Carson]

There are 1.2 billion of us Catholics, Parkers. Have we all enabled molesters?

If they have donated money, yes.

Like most Christians, we take up a collection at every mass. Some of that money goes to care for old priests who are now retired. Guess we're all guilty.

You're now free to hate all of us, PT, because we're all in collusion with the pedophiles we're harboring.

[Lemonvariable72]

If they have donated money, yes.

Like most Christians, we take up a collection at every mass. Some of that money goes to care for old priests who are now retired. Guess we're all guilty.

You're now free to hate all of us, PT, because we're all in collusion with the pedophiles we're harboring.

You lauigh but yes you are. You know pope Benedict was shown to be shuffling and protecting molesters as the bishop of munich.

[Randy Carson]

Like most Christians, we take up a collection at every mass. Some of that money goes to care for old priests who are now retired. Guess we're all guilty.

You're now free to hate all of us, PT, because we're all in collusion with the pedophiles we're harboring.

You lauigh but yes you are. You know pope Benedict was shown to be shuffling and protecting molesters as the bishop of munich.

You agree that the Huffington Post is not known for its conservatism, correct?

Pope Benedict On Child Abuse: 'I Never Tried To Cover These Things Up'
By NICOLE WINFIELD
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/24...82941.html

<excerpt>

As prefect, Ratzinger in 2001 compelled bishops around the world to send all credible cases of abuse to his office for review. He took the move because it had become clear to him that bishops were merely shuffling abusive priests around, rather than subjecting them to church trials.

Ratzinger actually tried in 1988 to get around the cumbersome church trials, asking the Vatican's legal office for quicker ways to permanently remove priests who raped and molested children. But he was rebuffed, with the legal office saying that doing so would compromise the priests' ability to defend themselves.

Ratzinger was hamstrung by Pope John Paul II's unspoken policy against letting young men leave the priesthood and his overriding concern with preserving the rights of accused clerics, often at the expense of victims – a concern formed in part by his experiences in communist-controlled Poland, where priests were often accused of trumped-up charges.

Eventually, a year after the abuse scandal exploded in the U.S., Ratzinger pushed through administrative changes in 2003 and 2004 that enabled his office to permanently remove abusers without going through a church trial. But that decision came decades after his office began receiving a steady stream of documentation about the scale of abuse in the U.S. – far too late, according to victims.

So, John Paul II was skeptical of the allegations because he had seen priests victimized by false accusations of the communists in Poland. But Ratzinger moved as quickly as he could to remove the priests - defrocking hundreds of them in the process.

Get your facts straight.

[abaris]

You agree that the Huffington Post is not known for its conservatism, correct?

Dont forget that some of us have access to German and international news coverage. The Huffington post isn't the first to report on it. Not by a long chalk.

[Lemonvariable72]

You lauigh but yes you are. You know pope Benedict was shown to be shuffling and protecting molesters as the bishop of munich.

You agree that the Huffington Post is not known for its conservatism, correct?

Pope Benedict On Child Abuse: 'I Never Tried To Cover These Things Up'
By NICOLE WINFIELD
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/24...82941.html

<excerpt>

As prefect, Ratzinger in 2001 compelled bishops around the world to send all credible cases of abuse to his office for review. He took the move because it had become clear to him that bishops were merely shuffling abusive priests around, rather than subjecting them to church trials.

Ratzinger actually tried in 1988 to get around the cumbersome church trials, asking the Vatican's legal office for quicker ways to permanently remove priests who raped and molested children. But he was rebuffed, with the legal office saying that doing so would compromise the priests' ability to defend themselves.

Ratzinger was hamstrung by Pope John Paul II's unspoken policy against letting young men leave the priesthood and his overriding concern with preserving the rights of accused clerics, often at the expense of victims – a concern formed in part by his experiences in communist-controlled Poland, where priests were often accused of trumped-up charges.

Eventually, a year after the abuse scandal exploded in the U.S., Ratzinger pushed through administrative changes in 2003 and 2004 that enabled his office to permanently remove abusers without going through a church trial. But that decision came decades after his office began receiving a steady stream of documentation about the scale of abuse in the U.S. – far too late, according to victims.

So, John Paul II was skeptical of the allegations because he had seen priests victimized by false accusations of the communists in Poland. But Ratzinger moved as quickly as he could to remove the priests - defrocking hundreds of them in the process.

Get your facts straight.

Wow and all that is intended to make the church look better?

[Lemonvariable72]

And as for the Huffington Post, it does not matter if they are liberal or not, they have been shown to an accurate and good news source. Moreover America doesn't have any liberal political party. You have moderate right wingers and nutjob right wingers. Come to Canada and see the handy work of people like Tommy Douglas and Pierre Trudeau and you will see more liberalism there then the US has seen since Carter. And guess what? We are better off in a whole lot of respects. :
- Universal healthcare that is comparable to most us paid healthcare.
- lower murder rates
- lower national debt
- lower personal debt
- better contraception access
- better education, by a large margin. (Canada is consistently in the top 15, us is in the 50s)
So yeah I know I went off topic but seriously don't lecture me about how conservatism Is better.