Given a chance would you kill baby Hitler?

[Anomalocaris]

German in the pre-1870 sense was about a shared language, not shared political entity.

[Lemonvariable72]

I wouldn't go back in time and shoot Hitler, as that is just trading a known variable for unknown one, and given how close we came to losing that is not a chance I'd wonna take. Instead I would go back further, probably 1770s and I would convince Louis the 16th to have me pose as his son and act the ideal French heir, and openly endorse enlightenment ideals. Then when cunt died I would take power and work to form France into a stable democracy based on enlightenment principles. Thus adverting the french revolution and Napoleonic wars whilst encouraging enlightenment and equality. As a result these value would spread all that much quicker thus sowing the seeds for an end to colonialism and a rise of democracy far quicker while being to maintain power by the advancement and wealth that an empowered middle class creates. The spreading of these ideals earlier would undermine imperialist authority and prevent the reorganization of Europe after the Napoleonic wars thus circumventing WWI while still slowly ending imperialism (namely by calling all colonials French citizens and giving the same voting rights and education.)

[abaris]

Thus adverting the french revolution and Napoleonic wars whilst encouraging enlightenment and equality.

Wow, just look up the original ideas of the French Revolution. Egalité, fraternité, liberté should give you some hints for starters. Also look at what Napoleon, despite being a warlord and absolute ruler, introduced in terms of legal and social reforms. As opposed to other contemporary rulers.

There's really nothing more to say about that.

[Mudhammam]

A more interesting question: If you were driving a bus full of children and you knew that kid Hitler was on board but you had no way of knowing which kid was Hitler, would you drive the bus off a cliff?

[Lemonvariable72]

Thus adverting the french revolution and Napoleonic wars whilst encouraging enlightenment and equality.

Wow, just look up the original ideas of the French Revolution. Egalité, fraternité, liberté should give you some hints for starters. Also look at what Napoleon, despite being a warlord and absolute ruler, introduced in terms of legal and social reforms. As opposed to other contemporary rulers.

There's really nothing more to say about that.

I what ideas were behind the French revolution, but truthfully the triggering event was a famine that was totally mishandled by the king and combine that with decandence of the ruling class and you have a revolution. What I would do is work to make that government far better managed and then slowly steer towards enlightenment ideals. As for Napoleon yes he spread some of those ideals but he also spread bitterness in the ruling class and did not spread Democratic rule.

[Aractus]

As I said, when playing the time game, there are other figures preventing the first cause for Hitler and saving millions of people in the process. Short term, since nobody can say what would have filled the void. Hitler's just the demon mask everyone associates with the Holocaust. But there's a very complicated chain of events leading up to a nobody taking over a major industrial nation.

When removing Hitler, WWI still would have happened. The treaty of Versailes still would have happened. Only the person leading the nationalist right would have been a different person. Maybe a less emotional, even more determined one. There were lots and lots to choose from, who carried the same resentments.

Exactly, killing Hitler would make no difference. Japan are the ones who started the war anyway, not the Germans.

[Jackalope]

Adapted?

Yes.

[abaris]

Exactly, killing Hitler would make no difference. Japan are the ones who started the war anyway, not the Germans.

But it was Hitler burning the last bridges by declaring war on the USA. On december 11th 1941. The only war he ever declared instead of simply attacking.

[Aractus]

Without strong allies though like Japan and Italy, Germany wouldn't have been in a position to start conquering Europe. The military alliance (the Tripartite Pact) was made in 1940, therefore any of the states that went to war began war for all of them.

There is another word for war: terrorism. The biggest terrorist state in the world today is the USA, and second biggest is Israel.

The conflict in Palestine/Israel is a problem created wholesale by Britain. They invaded and occupied Palestine as a colony (which was a relatively peaceful part of the middle-east where Muslims, Jews, and Christians lived together in peace) in 1917, refusing to recognise Palestine as a legitimate State. Now I actually have friends who are a really into history and wars, and they actually swallow the British propaganda that Palestine was "not yet a State" whole. The fact is Britain invaded it in typical divide-and-conquer style, and then didn't let the Palestinians govern themselves, and then decided to divide-up their land (for which a UN resolution was made) to share it with a new country called Israel. That despite the fact that prior to the British invasion in 1917, Jews lived in Palestine in peace - one of the few areas of the world that actually didn't treat them like infested maggots.

That problem persists today. Once they're done pushing out Palestinians entirely they'll start again on the Sinai Peninsula and the Syrian land that they previously stole and then handed-back. The Palestinian people, but the way, are indigenous to the land and I highly suggest reading the UN Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples.



The conflict in ISIL/Syria/Iraq (and the reason why I list ISIL as a State is because I believe eventually it will have to be recognised as one since it's pretty much now completely displaced Syria), is a problem created wholesale by the USA and its allies the UK and Australia, but mainly the USA. Again, they went into the region, started illegal wars, divide-and-conquer, and then left the instability to fester a new horrid governance. Again this is the textbook definition of terrorism, and the only difference between ISIL and Israel is that Israel is backed by the United States and ISIL isn't.

Germany lost land in WWI. As you know that territorial land issue is one of the things that fostered their involvement in WWII. But it's not right at all to simply say it was Germany's fault alone; if they didn't have military allies then they couldn't have gone to war. Japan, especially, and Italy are just as much to blame for WWII.

As for war hungry countries like the United States, I hope to God one day that Russia or Saudi or India or China starts war in their country and puts them in their goddamned place.

[Aractus]

(duplicate)