The Problem with Christians

[AJW333]

For others, they would deny it, even if they saw the dead raised, nothing would break down their prejudice.

I am a convinced Atheist. I'll make you a deal.

You show me an instance of someone who starts to live again after being clinically dead for say a week, in a way I can investigate myself* - so that I can rule out any obvious physical explanation - and I will believe in the supernatural.

Sounds familiar.

"And he said, ‘No, father Abraham, but if someone goes to them from the dead, they will repent.’ He said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the Prophets, neither will they be convinced if someone should rise from the dead.’” Luke 16:30

But there's another half to the bet. If you believe that you are going to spend eternity in heaven, you obviously don't need all your worldly goods. Any possession you have is irrelevant next to the eternal bliss that awaits you.

So give all your money to me, except a bit to feed, clothe and house you. If you know that - ultimately - you're going to be rewarded with far more than money, then anything you have now doesn't matter at all.

Deal?

I don't follow the logic. It sounds like you're saying, "because your afterlife is going to be better than this life, you should make this life a whole lot worse for yourself." Why would a rational person want to do that?

[IATIA]

But there's another half to the bet. If you believe that you are going to spend eternity in heaven, you obviously don't need all your worldly goods. Any possession you have is irrelevant next to the eternal bliss that awaits you.

So give all your money to me, except a bit to feed, clothe and house you. If you know that - ultimately - you're going to be rewarded with far more than money, then anything you have now doesn't matter at all.

Deal?

I don't follow the logic. It sounds like you're saying, "because your afterlife is going to be better than this life, you should make this life a whole lot worse for yourself." Why would a rational person want to do that?

Is that not what jesus professed that one should do?

[AJW333]

This idea that god created the universe is very recent. Neither Allah, Yahweh or Elohim are given credit in their respective holy books for creating the universe.  The writers of these books describe the earth and sky as it appears to the naked eye. They did not even know there was such a thing as a universe.
I'd like to study the etymology of the word "universe" and see when humans first started referring to the cosmos as such. My guess is it's only been less than 1000 years.

Hebrews 11:3

"By faith we understand that the universe was created by the word of God, so that what is seen was not made out of things that are visible."

---

I don't follow the logic. It sounds like you're saying, "because your afterlife is going to be better than this life, you should make this life a whole lot worse for yourself." Why would a rational person want to do that?

Is that not what jesus professed that one should do?

Nope.

[Cyberman]

This idea that god created the universe is very recent. Neither Allah, Yahweh or Elohim are given credit in their respective holy books for creating the universe.  The writers of these books describe the earth and sky as it appears to the naked eye. They did not even know there was such a thing as a universe.
I'd like to study the etymology of the word "universe" and see when humans first started referring to the cosmos as such. My guess is it's only been less than 1000 years.

Hebrews 11:3

"By faith we understand that the universe was created by the word of God, so that what is seen was not made out of things that are visible."

Universe (n.)
1580s, "the whole world, cosmos, the totality of existing things," from Old French univers (12c.), from Latin universum "all things, everybody, all people, the whole world," noun use of neuter of adjective universus "all together, all in one, whole, entire, relating to all," literally "turned into one," from unus "one" (see one) + versus, past participle of vertere "to turn" (see versus).

[abaris]

So you finally dropped the mask of being a man of science and open minded by quoting bible verses. In fact, you already dropped it by only selectively answering posts that are convenient to your imagined agenda.

So, another try. What is the actualy evidence for the supernatural existing?

[Silver]

"By faith

In relation to that horrendous f word, take a look at my signature.

[IATIA]

Is that not what jesus professed that one should do?

Nope.

Luke 14:33

So likewise, whosoever he be of you that forsaketh not all that he hath, he cannot be my disciple.

[J a c k]

AJ, AJ, AJ... 
I thought I told you in your intro thread that you couldn't use "Bible" until you repped me. 

I knew you would eventually use it. Theists never disappoint. 

[robvalue]

The very best a theist can hope for with all these word games and fake science is to establish that their beliefs might be true.

Might be. Yet they of course claim that they are true.

Trying to join up the dots between this already bogus "supernatural" equivocation and a storybook character by quoting bits of that book is.... I'm not even sure what the word is. But I don't think some people realise what little weight their book carries with those of us who aren't in their cult.

[TheRocketSurgeon]

I am a convinced Atheist. I'll make you a deal.

You show me an instance of someone who starts to live again after being clinically dead for say a week, in a way I can investigate myself* - so that I can rule out any obvious physical explanation - and I will believe in the supernatural.

Sounds familiar.

"And he said, ‘No, father Abraham, but if someone goes to them from the dead, they will repent.’ He said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the Prophets, neither will they be convinced if someone should rise from the dead.’” Luke 16:30

But there's another half to the bet. If you believe that you are going to spend eternity in heaven, you obviously don't need all your worldly goods. Any possession you have is irrelevant next to the eternal bliss that awaits you.

So give all your money to me, except a bit to feed, clothe and house you. If you know that - ultimately - you're going to be rewarded with far more than money, then anything you have now doesn't matter at all.

Deal?

I don't follow the logic. It sounds like you're saying, "because your afterlife is going to be better than this life, you should make this life a whole lot worse for yourself." Why would a rational person want to do that?

An excellent question. Let's ask god-and-son-of-god:



Matthew 19:21 Jesus answered, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."
[...]
28 Jesus said to them, “Truly I tell you, at the renewal of all things, when the Son of Man sits on his glorious throne, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. 29 And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or wifee or children or fields for my sake will receive a hundred times as much and will inherit eternal life. 30 But many who are first will be last, and many who are last will be first.

[Bold emphasis my own.]