Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: April 27, 2024, 1:46 am
Atheist Forums › Community › Religion › Christianity v
The Problem with Christians

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Thread Modes
The Problem with Christians
FatAndFaithless Offline
Chronic Masticator
****
Religious Views: Natalie Dormer's smirk
Posts: 7045
Threads: 20
Joined: June 17, 2014
Reputation: 55
#1151
RE: The Problem with Christians
April 2, 2016 at 2:58 pm
"Because we're the ones who REALLY have the answers, the other thousand sects have it wrong."
In every country and every age, the priest had been hostile to Liberty.
- Thomas Jefferson
Find
Reply
IATIA Offline
Complete idiot? Nope. Still missing parts.
****
Religious Views: Mereological Nihilism
Posts: 4196
Threads: 60
Joined: September 8, 2011
Reputation: 30
#1152
RE: The Problem with Christians
April 2, 2016 at 3:53 pm (This post was last modified: April 2, 2016 at 3:54 pm by IATIA.)
(April 2, 2016 at 1:48 pm)athrock Wrote:
(April 2, 2016 at 1:43 pm)Mr.wizard Wrote: Why would god have to allow or permit Pharaoh's heart to be hardened if Pharaoh already had free will? Either way your saying god intervened and changed something, which in turn would violate free will.

Um...read it again.

You should read it again!

Quote:Exodus 7 King James Version (KJV)
7 And the Lord said unto Moses, See, I have made thee a god to Pharaoh: and Aaron thy brother shall be thy prophet.
2 Thou shalt speak all that I command thee: and Aaron thy brother shall speak unto Pharaoh, that he send the children of Israel out of his land.
3 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, and multiply my signs and my wonders in the land of Egypt.
You make people miserable and there's nothing they can do about it, just like god.
-- Homer Simpson

God has no place within these walls, just as facts have no place within organized religion.
-- Superintendent Chalmers

Science is like a blabbermouth who ruins a movie by telling you how it ends. There are some things we don't want to know. Important things.
-- Ned Flanders

Once something's been approved by the government, it's no longer immoral.
-- The Rev Lovejoy
Find
Reply
The Grand Nudger Offline
Retired Staff
*****
Religious Views: Invasive
Posts: 66328
Threads: 140
Joined: June 28, 2011
Reputation: 160
#1153
RE: The Problem with Christians
April 2, 2016 at 3:56 pm (This post was last modified: April 2, 2016 at 3:57 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(April 2, 2016 at 2:53 pm)athrock Wrote: Because God Himself established the Catholic Church for the express purpose of assisting you on your journey home.

I'm not from The Mighty Cathol's home, nor does the church do -anything- to get me to the place I am from.  If I want to go home, I'll do so, no assistance required.  I have legs.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Find
Reply
abaris Offline
Posting Freak
*****
Religious Views: agnostic
Posts: 13122
Threads: 130
Joined: October 18, 2014
Reputation: 55
#1154
RE: The Problem with Christians
April 2, 2016 at 4:47 pm
(April 2, 2016 at 2:53 pm)athrock Wrote: Because God Himself established the Catholic Church for the express purpose of assisting you on your journey home.

Oh, I didn't know that God is called Theodosis. I call him Theo from now on.
[Image: Bumper+Sticker+-+Asheville+-+Praise+Dog3.JPG]
Find
Reply
athrock Offline
Surprise!
Religious Views: Catholic
Posts: 761
Threads: 18
Joined: November 24, 2015
Reputation: 4
#1155
RE: The Problem with Christians
April 2, 2016 at 4:58 pm
(April 2, 2016 at 2:16 pm)Mr.wizard Wrote:
(April 2, 2016 at 2:05 pm)athrock Wrote: If I permit or allow someone to drive my car, and they freely choose to drive it off of a cliff, that is not the same as saying that I personally drove them off the cliff myself.

God allowed Pharaoh's heart to be hardened, but he was not the agent doing the actual hardening. Pharaoh was permitted or allowed to harden his own heart.

But I think the article says more than just this point.
But why would he need god's permission if he had free will already?

We're saying the same thing.  

God would have preferred that Pharaoh simply accept Moses' initial request, but it didn't play out that way. God allowed or permitted Pharaoh to harden his own heart rather than FORCING him to let the Israelites go.
Find
Reply
athrock Offline
Surprise!
Religious Views: Catholic
Posts: 761
Threads: 18
Joined: November 24, 2015
Reputation: 4
#1156
RE: The Problem with Christians
April 2, 2016 at 5:00 pm
(April 2, 2016 at 2:58 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: "Because we're the ones who REALLY have the answers, the other thousand sects have it wrong."

Correct.

The fact that you don't understand why this is the case is a big part of your problem.
Find
Reply
athrock Offline
Surprise!
Religious Views: Catholic
Posts: 761
Threads: 18
Joined: November 24, 2015
Reputation: 4
#1157
RE: The Problem with Christians
April 2, 2016 at 5:02 pm
(April 2, 2016 at 3:53 pm)IATIA Wrote:
(April 2, 2016 at 1:48 pm)athrock Wrote: Um...read it again.

You should read it again!

Quote:Exodus 7   King James Version (KJV)
7 And the Lord said unto Moses, See, I have made thee a god to Pharaoh: and Aaron thy brother shall be thy prophet.
2 Thou shalt speak all that I command thee: and Aaron thy brother shall speak unto Pharaoh, that he send the children of Israel out of his land.
3 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, and multiply my signs and my wonders in the land of Egypt.

Not that. Read the article that I linked to again. 

It explains Exodus 7:3.
Find
Reply
athrock Offline
Surprise!
Religious Views: Catholic
Posts: 761
Threads: 18
Joined: November 24, 2015
Reputation: 4
#1158
RE: The Problem with Christians
April 2, 2016 at 5:03 pm
(April 2, 2016 at 3:56 pm)Rhythm Wrote:
(April 2, 2016 at 2:53 pm)athrock Wrote: Because God Himself established the Catholic Church for the express purpose of assisting you on your journey home.

I'm not from The Mighty Cathol's home, nor does the church do -anything- to get me to the place I am from.  If I want to go home, I'll do so, no assistance required.  I have legs.

You are so far out of your depth at this point...
Find
Reply
IATIA Offline
Complete idiot? Nope. Still missing parts.
****
Religious Views: Mereological Nihilism
Posts: 4196
Threads: 60
Joined: September 8, 2011
Reputation: 30
#1159
RE: The Problem with Christians
April 2, 2016 at 5:03 pm (This post was last modified: April 2, 2016 at 5:04 pm by IATIA.)
(April 2, 2016 at 4:58 pm)athrock Wrote: God would have preferred that Pharaoh simply accept Moses' initial request, but it didn't play out that way. God allowed or permitted Pharaoh to harden his own heart rather than FORCING him to let the Israelites go.

Wrong!  Read it again!

Quote:Exodus 7   King James Version (KJV)
7 And the Lord said unto Moses, See, I have made thee a god to Pharaoh: and Aaron thy brother shall be thy prophet.
2 Thou shalt speak all that I command thee: and Aaron thy brother shall speak unto Pharaoh, that he send the children of Israel out of his land.
3 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, and multiply my signs and my wonders in the land of Egypt.

Your god was adamant that the plagues would ensue and having the Pharaoh give in was not part of the plan.
You make people miserable and there's nothing they can do about it, just like god.
-- Homer Simpson

God has no place within these walls, just as facts have no place within organized religion.
-- Superintendent Chalmers

Science is like a blabbermouth who ruins a movie by telling you how it ends. There are some things we don't want to know. Important things.
-- Ned Flanders

Once something's been approved by the government, it's no longer immoral.
-- The Rev Lovejoy
Find
Reply
IATIA Offline
Complete idiot? Nope. Still missing parts.
****
Religious Views: Mereological Nihilism
Posts: 4196
Threads: 60
Joined: September 8, 2011
Reputation: 30
#1160
RE: The Problem with Christians
April 2, 2016 at 5:05 pm
(April 2, 2016 at 5:02 pm)athrock Wrote: Not that. Read the article that I linked to again. 

It explains Exodus 7:3.

I can read. It says that god intends to harden the Pharaoh's heart.
You make people miserable and there's nothing they can do about it, just like god.
-- Homer Simpson

God has no place within these walls, just as facts have no place within organized religion.
-- Superintendent Chalmers

Science is like a blabbermouth who ruins a movie by telling you how it ends. There are some things we don't want to know. Important things.
-- Ned Flanders

Once something's been approved by the government, it's no longer immoral.
-- The Rev Lovejoy
Find
Reply


Atheist Forums › Community › Religion › Christianity v
The Problem with Christians

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Christians vs Christians (yec) Fake Messiah 52 7815 January 31, 2019 at 2:08 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Why do Christians become Christians? SteveII 168 31253 May 20, 2016 at 8:43 pm
Last Post: drfuzzy
  Christians. Prove That You Are Real/True Christians Nope 155 51178 September 1, 2015 at 1:26 pm
Last Post: Pyrrho
  Christians : my problem with Christianity, some questions. WinterHold 115 19682 March 28, 2015 at 7:43 am
Last Post: h4ym4n
  The Problem of Evil, Christians, and Inconsistency Mudhammam 46 10400 September 24, 2014 at 5:22 am
Last Post: genkaus
  The first Christians weren't Bible Christians Phatt Matt s 60 15809 March 26, 2014 at 10:26 am
Last Post: rightcoaster
  Now Christians piss of Christians. leo-rcc 10 9946 December 11, 2010 at 4:02 pm
Last Post: Anomalocaris



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)