Apparitions from heaven???

[Minimalist]

Imagine if this happened during a religious gathering:



http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap161031.html

I'm no photography expert, but that looks incredibly fake to me.

The jesus shits wouldn't care.  They love to be fooled.

[Jehanne]

I think any normal person can tell those are just northern lights. The most convincing apparition to me is the miracle of the sun in Fatima.

Not every one was convinced:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miracle_of..._the_event

[Catholic_Lady]

That's the story, yes. How was the rest of the Solar System not affected? Why did nobody outside this one tiny village not notice anything? You can see the effects of the Sun's apparent diurnal motion every day. Have the Sun nipping about the sky off its axis and more than half the planet is going to spot something odd, even if everything else is equal.

Because it was a visual miracle for the people who were gathered at that spot. It wasn't supposed to actually have effects in the solar system, or to be seen by everyone in the world.  

The 3 children had been claiming to be seeing and speaking with the Virgin Mary for quite some time. Nobody in the town believed them. So Mary said she'd do something on October 13 at 1:00pm (I think that was the time she said) at that exact spot to show people that they were not lying. So the kids got the word out there that something would happen at that spot at that time. And tens of thousands of people came and gathered there that day to see.

[pocaracas]

CL, you can read Portuguese, right?
Here's the news story written shortly after:
http://www.deuslovult.org/2009/05/19/mil...-o-seculo/

After hours in the scorching sun, some people claimed to have seen a wobble.
Not your average scorching sun, one of those that comes after some heavy raining (astronomers favorite time to peer through their telescopes, it's when rain forces dust particles to fall down and the atmosphere is clear).
Raining meant that the ground was wet.
Scorching sun evaporates water.
Have you ever seen the refraction of light on a moving column of air?.. A mirage...

[Cyberman]

Because it was a visual miracle for the people who were gathered at that spot. It wasn't supposed to actually have effects in the solar system, or to be seen by everyone in the world.  

So what are we saying happened, here? Was it the actual Sun moving around, or a visual phenomenon localised to this one tiny village? If the former, how were the concomitant effects negated? If the latter, how to prove it beyond group hallucination and wishful thinking?

[Doubting Thomas]

After hours in the scorching sun, some people claimed to have seen a wobble.

And of course after 100 years of people telling & retelling the story, it went from a little wobble to the sun dancing all around the sky & changing colors.

[Simon Moon]

What about it do you find convincing? Or a miracle?

There were thousands of witnesses. Many of whom were objective, from different or no religious background, as well as reporters.

And not everyone saw the so called apparition that were there.

Not to mention, there are quite a few natural explanations for the apparition, like a sun-dog, stratospheric dust (which caused a similar event in China, but they did not call it a miracle), and others.

Not to mention, that no one else in any other town in the area saw the apparition, not did any astronomer.

[Catholic_Lady]

Because it was a visual miracle for the people who were gathered at that spot. It wasn't supposed to actually have effects in the solar system, or to be seen by everyone in the world.  

So what are we saying happened, here? Was it the actual Sun moving around, or a visual phenomenon localised to this one tiny village? If the former, how were the concomitant effects negated? If the latter, how to prove it beyond group hallucination and wishful thinking?

It was the actual sun moving, though without disrupting the solar system, and with only being visible to the 50k+ people gathered at that spot. The point of it was to show the town that the children were indeed telling the truth. So it had no effect on the world or on everyone else who was not there.

I just find it very unlikely that tens of thousands of people had the same hallucination at the same time, as predicted by 3 kids. Not everyone there were Catholics who believed the kids and who actually expected to see something. Also, the kids didn't say it would have anything to do with the sun... just that something would happen, but they had no idea what it would be.

[Cyberman]

You think thousands of people, even if that figure is accurate, reporting having seen the Sun literally flying around off its axis with no physical effects is more convincing than literally millions of people on the rest of the planet not seeing anything at all?

This miracle is even more remarkable than it says on the tin.

[Jehanne]

So what are we saying happened, here? Was it the actual Sun moving around, or a visual phenomenon localised to this one tiny village? If the former, how were the concomitant effects negated? If the latter, how to prove it beyond group hallucination and wishful thinking?

It was the actual sun moving, though without disrupting the solar system, and with only being visible to the 50k+ people gathered at that spot. The point of it was to show the town that the children were indeed telling the truth. So it had no effect on the world or on everyone else who was not there.

I just find it very unlikely that tens of thousands of people had the same hallucination at the same time, as predicted by 3 kids. Not everyone there were Catholics who believed the kids and who actually expected to see something. Also, the kids didn't say it would have anything to do with the sun... just that something would happen, but they had no idea what it would be.

The "kids" never predicted the so-called "miracle"; your history is extremely poor.  What they predicted was a miracle, not necessarily one having to do with the Sun; in fact, Lucia never mentioned the Sun prior to the October 13, 1917 event.  Also, the kiddos made other claims, such as being visited by an angel who gave them a consecrated host:



https://www.opusangelorum.org/English/Fa...arist.html


These so-called events, all prior to the October 1917 one, happened at least a half-dozen times, or so say the kids.