Tired workers cost biz billions. NO SHIT

[Brian37]

Ahhhh, but this is about you. It's all about you. I don't think you really give a shit about anyone but yourself and maybe your mom. 

The whole world is out to personally fuck you over. Poor, poor Brian. Better grab the lube!

He's making it personal. But one of the reasons why I seldomly agree with him. But he's bringing up valid points in this thread. Most of all what we, as a society, consider important and what we tend to brush under the rug. Which jobs we tend to value and if these jobs really are the most important to move us forward.

It's a pitty that Brian throws a fit again, but I consider the discussion to be pretty important and getting far too little attention. As I said, I observed it from both sides. Working the field and having a relative in need of the services. One day I may require these services too. There was a time when I worked the emergency services, that we discussed amongst us to off ourselves before being confined in any of these facilities for the rest of our lives.

We just elected an inept narcissistic jackass whom is a con artist who like the GOP will continue the same failed deregulation and trickle up policies that gave us BUSH. Yea, I am throwing a fit, everyone should. 

Nursing homes are only one example where cutting corners is dangerous, but because of the attitude of deregulation those places are run by assholes who think you can treat them like a fast food joint. 

But that is one aspect of business. We just had a business down here SUED for cutting corners trying to repair a building's plumbing and electrical system WITHOUT a licensed contractor. Again, it isn't one person, or one business, but the stupid idea that regulations are a bad thing. Regulations are WHY NADER was right and cars improved their safety standards. 

And even if some dont moves up, but many do, the difference between the top and bottom cannot keep exploding. It is no different than stretching a rope or chain beyond it's capacity. We have just elected an idiot who is in bed with assholes who want to  turn America's budgets for their own personal casino. THAT is what bothers me because we have seen it before.

Yes Abris, I am throwing a fit, any sane person should.

[dyresand]

the democratic establishment and the gop are the ones really causing this work harder for less thing to happen because
money in politics and such. So when a good president comes along like Bernie or even Jill why do you think they panic and
why do you think they even had to push and use unfair tactics and voter manipulation and other things to get Hillary to win.
She is one of the key reasons why we have this problem now because too many people are punching down. Literally a fox news
host defended the working class saying they need a living wage and person arguing against that said people need to work harder.
The sad fact of the matter trickle down economics is bullshit so is capitalism is even more bullshit since the average person doesn't
make money from it unless you know you make a invention patent it even then the costs of manufacturing and other things. To put it like we
as a country have a vast amount being unevenly distributed that fact is if people got paid what they really are worth we would have no lower class
things would get better and the rich in truth would earn more than overworking people for less because people would be happy.

[Brian37]

the democratic establishment and the gop are the ones really causing this work harder for less thing to happen because
money in politics and such.

UGGGGGGGG

No no no no no. 

Reagan and the GOP are responsible. 36 years of GOP gerrymandering have forced our left to slightly right of center. The GOP has had a majority of power of all three branches in that time, that forces the left to compromise too much. GOP also controls the majority of power in state congresses and governorships. Our voter apathy in local and state and midterms in that time also does not help.

Now, I'd only agree that the rich do pit the parties against each other, that does allow for either gridlock which allows the laws to remain the same, or it allows them to right more laws that benefit the uber rich. Citizens United is a disaster and now, even more scary considering the GOP "fuck you I got mine" attitude.

If the left would think long term and think every county town and city long term, the GOP would never win. We really are a liberal country both socially and economically. It is just that the top knows how to manipulate people to vote against their own self interests.

[Tonus]

Yea, I am throwing a fit, everyone should.

Throwing a fit doesn't do anything besides make you feel a bit better for a short while. The first thing people should do is figure out how to cope, since the source of their angst is not going away; on the contrary, in about six weeks he'll be settling into his new office. The second thing people should do is figure out how to proceed, which mostly consists of NOT spending the next two years throwing a constant fit and instead reading up on their local government offices and preparing for the mid-terms in two years.

The closest anyone should get to throwing a fit is staying aware of what is happening over the next four years and writing polite and concise letters to their local representatives in the hopes of influencing congressional votes. Or joining local political groups that seek to pressure their representatives into, you know... representing them. If you think that this will be a waste of time, consider that it is being compared to loudly complaining on the internet. Throwing a fit is an effective way of expending a bit of energy, but it has a poor track record of improving anyone's situation. My advice to everyone is to throw fewer fits and put that energy to more productive use.

[abaris]

Yes Abris, I am throwing a fit, any sane person should.

Not if you want to have a sane discussion over valid points. Otherwise it just goes under in that emotional rant of yours. I guess it's not your intent to antagonize people but to make them think and reflect. Right now you're doing the opposite.

[dyresand]

the democratic establishment and the gop are the ones really causing this work harder for less thing to happen because
money in politics and such.

UGGGGGGGG

No no no no no. 

Reagan and the GOP are responsible. 36 years of GOP gerrymandering have forced our left to slightly right of center. The GOP has had a majority of power of all three branches in that time, that forces the left to compromise too much. GOP also controls the majority of power in state congresses and governorships. Our voter apathy in local and state and midterms in that time also does not help.

Now, I'd only agree that the rich do pit the parties against each other, that does allow for either gridlock which allows the laws to remain the same, or it allows them to right more laws that benefit the uber rich. Citizens United is a disaster and now, even more scary considering the GOP "fuck you I got mine" attitude.

If the left would think long term and think every county town and city long term, the GOP would never win. We really are a liberal country both socially and economically. It is just that the top knows how to manipulate people to vote against their own self interests.

I wouldn't consider myself a liberal when it comes to money i am highly conservative and i see buying a house, car, Jewelry etc a complete waste. 
But at the same time like many millennials i find myself more socialist than liberal. Personally i don't want people to over work themselves for shit pay 
and it never should get this far out of hand but it has.

[Brian37]

Yes Abris, I am throwing a fit, any sane person should.

Not if you want to have a sane discussion over valid points. Otherwise it just goes under in that emotional rant of yours. I guess it's not your intent to antagonize people but to make them think and reflect. Right now you're doing the opposite.

Yet it is ok for a politician running for the most powerful position on the planet to "throw a fit", but not ok for a no name to stick a mirror to their face?

Never occurs to them, maybe that is my intent on top of merely being pissed off. 

I would love to have more calm politics, but right now, no. Trump and his goons lit a fire, a very dangerous fire and the time for politeness flew out the window a long time ago.

So ok I will make a very short list, minus the "ranting". But, watch as even that gets ignored. 

1. Liberals are not anti private sector.
2. Liberals don't hate all wealth.
3. The pay gap cannot continue to explode.
4. Regulations are not robbery.
5. Nobody should begrudge those who move up
6. Better pay creates more stability
7. Watch as the right ignores this 

Abris, the civility ship left when McConnell shit his pants over the black guy winning. The civility ship left a long time ago when Trump started selling the birther crap. The civility ship left a long time ago when Fox News became a propaganda machine. The civility ship left a long time ago when Trump called Mexicans rapists, captured veterans losers, scapegoated sitting judges, repeated sexist comments to women, suggesting harm and arrest of political rivals. ECT ECT ECT

The scare tactics work unfortunately, otherwise we would not have now a president elect who. bar none, has be the most vile politician in U.S. History.

[John V]

@Brian: how many jobs do you have? If too many, why don't you just get training for a better job?

None of your business

Obama's been in for 8 years. Why didn't you get trained for a good-paying job in, say, clean energy?

[Opoponax]

Why not work for yourself?  Be your own boss?  Implement your business model that pays your employees well. Bless many lives including your own.

This is idiotic. 

Not every person is cut out to be an entrepreneur. And try getting a business loan on an idea. That, if it ever did exist, flew the coup decades ago. 

You have to have the capital, be willing to take the risk, and identify a niche that's not being filled or could be filled better in X way. Then you have to weigh the risks of losing your health insurance. See, in America, unlike every other advanced nation in the planet, we do what Jesus would do and say, "Tough shit if you don't have health insurance!" 

So the very thing that conservative Christians are so against represents a real impediment to your suggestion of just striking out one's own. 

I've owned two businesses over the course of 20+ years, and hopefully this time next year I'll be getting ready to start my third. But what I understand is that I simply cannot do anything but that. It's almost all I've ever known. I don't know how to work for someone else. All I'm gonna get is what they're going to give me no matter what I do. And on the other side of the coin are those who work hard, do what they're asked, and then when the workday is done, they want to go home and not worry about shit else except what they want to worry about. But now that's changed. Office memos go out over email at night, so you need to check your email when you're at home so that you're up on Whatever the Fuck some busybody wants you to be aware of when you come in the next day. And weekends are often expected too. And after god knows how many years maybe you'll get more than 5 days vacation a year. But be careful because the new guy doesn't take vacations and he's willing to do your job for less. 

Good god, fuck that.

I can't believe that people put up with that shit, but the vast majority do. And for that, I find it impossible to begrudge them a better wage. You shouldn't either and that solution of "Just start your own thing" is a load of horseshit for all but a few of us.

[Amarok]

None of your business

Obama's been in for 8 years. Why didn't you get trained for a good-paying job in, say, clean energy?

Because it isn't that simple

And your crass bullshit is not appreciated