5 times we almost nuked ourselves by accident

[orogenicman]

[Anomalocaris]

Don't forget a recent incident when a B52 meant to ferry practice dummy training rounds flew across the country with live nuclear weapons due to a mixup. Or a consignment of discarded weapon triggers meant to be scrapped was shipped to Taiwan by mistake.

[orogenicman]

Don't forget a recent incident when a B52 meant to ferry practice dummy training rounds flew across the country with live nuclear weapons due to a mixup. Or a consignment of discarded weapon triggers meant to be scrapped was shipped to Taiwan by mistake.

Yeah, incidents like that are all the more reason we need to get rid of these nasty bombs. It gives me the willys.

[Anomalocaris]

[Minimalist]

[lrh9]

I always have been and still am a big believer in MAD. Any rational agent will not attack or invade you if it means his/her/its own self destruction. I'd like to say I'm not a product or heir of the cold war era. I was born in 1989, the year the wall was torn down.

My primary fear of nuclear weaponry stems from the consequences if it falls into the hands of irrational agents. We've all witnessed the birth of mass terrorism. We're all cognizant of what certain types of people in the world want to do regardless of the consequences to others or themselves.

However, I still remain optimistic about the atom. MAD precisely prevents costly - in terms of human lives - mass invasions. I freely admit that I don't like the system because of its inherent flaw when it comes to irrational agents. I'd like an operative missile defense system, but it's the best system we have at the moment.

Let's not forget energy applications. No other form of energy has the potential to supply so many people with energy with so little pollution. In fact, I'd wager that there are some energy hungry endeavors that simply won't be possible without nuclear energy.

Of course I agree that we must continually strive to improve the technology and our methods of interacting with it.

Be fair, rational, and level headed.

[orogenicman]

I always have been and still am a big believer in MAD. Any rational agent will not attack or invade you if it means his/her/its own self destruction. I'd like to say I'm not a product or heir of the cold war era. I was born in 1989, the year the wall was torn down.

My primary fear of nuclear weaponry stems from the consequences if it falls into the hands of irrational agents. We've all witnessed the birth of mass terrorism. We're all cognizant of what certain types of people in the world want to do regardless of the consequences to others or themselves.

However, I still remain optimistic about the atom. MAD precisely prevents costly - in terms of human lives - mass invasions. I freely admit that I don't like the system because of its inherent flaw when it comes to irrational agents. I'd like an operative missile defense system, but it's the best system we have at the moment.

Let's not forget energy applications. No other form of energy has the potential to supply so many people with energy with so little pollution. In fact, I'd wager that there are some energy hungry endeavors that simply won't be possible without nuclear energy.

Of course I agree that we must continually strive to improve the technology and our methods of interacting with it.

Be fair, rational, and level headed.

There is nothing rational (or moral) about building enough nuclear weapons to kill mankind five times over regardless of the claims of needing to do so. You may say that you are not a product or heir of the cold war, but I'm sorry to say that that doesn't get you out from under the fact that there are thousands of nukes in this world that can snuff you and me out in a nanosecond.

"who holds the aces
the east or the west
this is the crap
our children are learning"

-Roger Waters

[Anomalocaris]

I always have been and still am a big believer in MAD. Any rational agent will not attack or invade you if it means his/her/its own self destruction.

Any rational agent that finds himself in MAD must also ostentatiously ensure that if he is ever led to believe that you are attacking him, even if by false information, he must destroy you, lest the information be true.

In case you wonder how slippery the slope of rationality is, consider the Perimeter system. This is a system the Soviets implemented in late 1980s to ensure completely autonomous, human-decision-free, nuclear retaliation decision. When the septuagenarian Konstantine Cherneanko succeeded to the position of General Secretary and Chairman of Presidium of the Supreme Soviet, he assumed the final authority for use of Soviet Nuclear arsenal. But so frail already was his health that he could not finish sentences in his public speech without grasping his podium for support and pausing for up to 30 seconds to catch his breath. The Soviet military, fearing that Cherneanko's health and power of decision will fail under the stress of a potential US nuclear attack, developed an unique system that, once activated, would automatically monitor radiation, seismic, accoustic sensors and radars, and automatically launch the entire soviet nuclear arsenal at the US if it thinks it detects any unexpected nuclear explosions in Soviet territory. The system works without any human operator. Once the system decides it was under attack and issues its completely automatic electronic launch commands to all Soviet strategic missiles, no human operator can comprehensively countermand the launch. The whole system was intended to ensure that United States will not survive even if it were to successfully pull off a decapitation strike that kills the entire Soviet leadership. There may be deterrence value in this system if the US was made aware of it. But the Soviets kept it secret, so this system literally contributed nothing to deterrence and stability before any nuclear war. It's only role to was to ensure the world would not survive what the computer might think was an attack on the Soviet Union.

Think about it, for a couple of years after you were born, the human civilization did not perish only because pieces of Soviet electronics, not renowned for its sophistication, reliability or quality of system integration, did not fail. The destruction part of muturally assured destruction was somewhat more assured than you realized, I think.

[lrh9]

My position still stands.

[Anomalocaris]

My position still stands.

It stands on what?