Damned Catholics

[Captain Scarlet]

Minimalist you have no proof that he is guilty. Please do post some proof thanks.

Jesus told him, through a personal experience. That should be good enough evidence, right? It is what you guys use.

[dqualk]

An archbishop who saved some 10,000 Jews during the Second World War in his collaboration with Pope Pius XII died Monday. He was 98.

http://www.ewtn.com/library/CHISTORY/zprelate.HTM

Jesus told him, through a personal experience. That should be good enough evidence, right? It is what you guys use.

Nice, avoid the subject then build a straw man so you can feel good about yourself for thinking theist are dumb, and atheists are the only rational people on earth. I wonder how long you will be able to go blindly about thinking your world view is the only legitimate one haha.

[thesummerqueen]

The Pope was guilty by ignoring it, which you obviously missed in Min's statement, and again...use of sarcasm from Scarlet. If you don't like it, ignore it.

[dqualk]

Are you guilty for ignoring the crime of the world. Perhaps if you were more vigilant, and patrolling the streets, and paying attention more closely to everything around you, then you would be able to stop more crimes. The fact is the Pope did not find out about the case until WAY late, and the priest was on his death bed. There is no sense in defrocking a dying priest who died a few months later. He had already sought out forgivness, and he was out of active ministry. He could not be around people because he was confined to his death bed.

[thesummerqueen]

Do you see the difference between me not acting like superman and the head of an organization that knew about what was going on directly ignoring those crimes? You better believe I'd go Bruce Campbell if I were witnessing a crime. Don't foist false blame on me to make your beloved leader seem less culpable. Ooo, so he found out way too late about THAT guy...and all the others? You know, in secular circles when we have one thing go drastically wrong like that, we tend to have investigations to root out the problem entirely. I guess there might have been an investigation, but it appears the diseased branches were allowed to stay.

[dqualk]

[quote] Too bad the French revolution didn't finish the job. [quote]

This is funny that you should say this becaue the French Revolution was pretty much a genocide. So you support genocides where innocent priests and nun are murdered and raped? That is sad. How hypcritical of you.

I'm sure I'll hear, well I did not mean it I was just kidding, (or at least I hope I will)

yet when I say that the abuse scandal is not as bad as it sounds when talking about its implications upon the whole Church relative to other institutions I get mocked and taken completely out of context to no end. This is intellectual dishonesty so that some may remain ignorant, I guess its like a wish fulfillment of sorts. The fact is, althoguh I put my foot in my mouth, what I meant was that abuse happens everywhere and in every institution, and it is disgusting, and those people deserve life in prison at best, but those cases do not reflect upon the Church as a whole as some try to claim. And then I attempt to argue my point as to why it is not binding on the entire Church, but then I make too much sense, so we have to believe in a lie, that I support the evil of molestation or something. Lame.

[Dotard]

It's called Justice ya twit!

Just because he 'sought forgivness' and was bed-ridden does not exonerate the puke. His "few months" before he died should have been spent in a prison death-bed.

Your truely believing this 'seek forgiveness' shit is good enough to be pardoned for your crimes and be "forgiven" of them further evidences your sick mind. It shows you not only support the cover-ups of child molesting crimes, but gives evidence you would actively participate in such cover-ups.

Which leads one to believe......

Hmmm... I support covering up marijuana smoking/possesion crimes because, I smoke marijuana.

Some American bankers would support covering up money laundering crimes because they have been laundering money for mexican cartels.

Yes I'm drawing a parallel here.

[Captain Scarlet]

Nice, avoid the subject then build a straw man so you can feel good about yourself for thinking theist are dumb, and atheists are the only rational people on earth. I wonder how long you will be able to go blindly about thinking your world view is the only legitimate one haha.

I wasn't engaging in a formal debate with you. You appear to be foreign to the concept, but if you want to start a ridiculous fallacy war then go look at your own posts first.

I was pointing out that your arguments have disappeared do far up your own theist dark passage, that you cannot see anything else. Then have the cheek to turn round and accuse me of going around blindly. Priceless fella.

[dqualk]

I was pointing out that your arguments have disappeared do far up your own theist dark passage, that you cannot see anything else. Then have the cheek to turn round and accuse me of going around blindly. Priceless fella.

You and others keep saying things like this but you do not point out what it is that I don't see. And if you do get around to pointing it out you say that I cannot see that God is irrational. Or that it is a huge problem that there is no conclusive evidence for God. To which I reply and most all scholars agree that the idea of God is not irrational, it is suprarational, and that there is not conclusive evidence for properly basic beliefs. If you want to argue that you do not believe that believeing in God can be properly basic, that is find, but I for one believe that it can be. It flows naturally from the properly basic belief in intrinsic value, right and wrong, truth etc. Others have postulated a God or something similar without revealed religion, like Plato and Aristotle.

If you are saying I cannot see that there are evil people in the Catholic Church, then you are lying to yourself, because I have repeatedly comndemed the idiots who do evil things like molest or cover up evil. However, I make an appeal to reason, that blaming all Catholics for the actions of a few is silly. Or saying the Church as a whole is evil is silly. There are many heroes within the Church, and the Church's teachings and Canon Law are good with regards to molestation and cover ups.

[Captain Scarlet]

I was pointing out that your arguments have disappeared do far up your own theist dark passage, that you cannot see anything else. Then have the cheek to turn round and accuse me of going around blindly. Priceless fella.

You and others keep saying things like this but you do not point out what it is that I don't see. And if you do get around to pointing it out you say that I cannot see that God is irrational. Or that it is a huge problem that there is no conclusive evidence for God. To which I reply and most all scholars agree that the idea of God is not irrational, it is suprarational, and that there is not conclusive evidence for properly basic beliefs. If you want to argue that you do not believe that believeing in God can be properly basic, that is find, but I for one believe that it can be. It flows naturally from the properly basic belief in intrinsic value, right and wrong, truth etc. Others have postulated a God or something similar without revealed religion, like Plato and Aristotle.

If you are saying I cannot see that there are evil people in the Catholic Church, then you are lying to yourself, because I have repeatedly comndemed the idiots who do evil things like molest or cover up evil. However, I make an appeal to reason, that blaming all Catholics for the actions of a few is silly. Or saying the Church as a whole is evil is silly. There are many heroes within the Church, and the Church's teachings and Canon Law are good with regards to molestation and cover ups.

You sound like you've swallowed an Alvin Plantinga special. The xtian god is an incoherent being and therefore irrational. Belief in a god (deism for example) isn't irrational, just highly, highly etc etc improbable.

Why is the xtian god irrational? Becuase his attributes are logcial contradictory (and they are well surveyed and understood). As yet their xtian refutations amount to ah but we don't really understand god, and are extremely weak.

There are also a set of powerful inductive arguments (hiddeness of god, mind-brain connection, religious confusion, success of natural science, the problem of innocent suffering and evil; to which the bluster of the FWD has not been totally successful), which make atheism far more likely. Whether you think they amount to a refutation will depend on your view of each of the premises and arguments.

There are many heros and monsters in all walks of life, it proves nothing about Catholicism nor any other organisation. I wonder if the little boys and girls who were raped, (which was then covered up by the institution you seem to want to promote) are warmed by your condemnation or those of the pope.