If God is a witness to all things...

[The Grand Nudger]

The quran -is- the propaganda of sunnis and shiites.  You appear to be having difficulties accepting that fact, but....if you're gonna throw your chips in with magic book you're gonna have to accept magic book...warts and all.

Your beliefs may be different, but magic book is magic book regardless of your beliefs.

[Brian37]

MOMMY! Listen you guys, you're both fans of MO, we get that. Allah chocolate bar and Moseltoff cocktail and all the trimmings.

Meanwhile over here in Jesus land, we have Christians on the right, Christians on the left, using the same book to come to different conclusions. 

This outsider, me, the guy who doesn't buy any god claim, looks at Christians and Muslims and Jews knowing and accepting the age of the universe and knowing religion nor humans were around back then.

AND DAMN IT............ 

I don't want Mystic dead, I don't want you dead, I don't want Jew dead, I don't want Catholic Lady dead.

But I am screaming in my head to most of my fellow humans, " YES ALL OF YOU ARE capable of doing good and being good".

This outsider,me, simply looks at humanity, and just want you all, all 7 billion humans, to consider there is no sky hero helping any of us, and if we want to help each other, each other is all we have.

When I debate Christians and Muslims and Jews, to me, it is like looking at my favorite NFL team the Redskins, and seeing the owner, and general manager and players all fight each other, and argue over how to win games and all I can think with my fellow humans, is " IT IS 2017 GUYS"

Why is any religion rooted in antiquity allowing that much division among my fellow humans when I know we are far more capable of good things, then arguing over antiquity?

I am not telling MK, or ATLASS or Catholic Lady or any religion to go away, I just want my fellow humans to consider that our morality was never handed down to us, and has always been in our genes.

Now excuse me while I go barbecue a kitten.

I always said that in my faith; in the book I believe in; difference in peoples' mentality is natural; it's God who willed for that; not me:

Sura 11, The Quran:
(118) And if your Lord had willed, He would certainly have made mankind a single nation. Yet they shall continue to differ.
(119) except those on whom your Lord has mercy and that is why He created them and the word of your Lord has been fulfilled: ‘I will surely fill hell with jinn and humans, all together!’

I'm not quoting this to convert you. I'm quoting this to tell you about the difference in mentality and belief that I have, and think is the whole purpose behind this religion.

We will always differ; no matter what. It's not up to me to decide; but it's up to me to try to save my own soul from hell.
Speeches about "the kingdom of God" or "The coming of the Mesiah/Mehdi", are all dreams of weird people, used a lot to control societies. That is what I'm trying to tell to you and every person reading me writing here: don't be a Muslim if you don't want to. But please admit that the Quran said something totally different than the propaganda of Shiites and Sunnies.

Did you try kitten cakes? just like crab cakes but the main component is cat flesh.

Well that does it for me, if you are not going to bow to me and become an ABBA fan, then yea, we have a problem.

I will NOT associate with anyone who doesn't like "Dancing Queen".

Hey, you have your religion, I have mine. M-KAY?

Oh yes, and my mom did drop me on my head alot as a kid so.......


Hey now, I don't tell you how to make suicide vests, don't tell me how to cook kittens. 

I know damned good and well how to cook kittens. 

In all seriousness, I can live with you even though I think you are full of crap, and I don't think you need a religion or god at all. Just try to get through your life without violence to others that really is the best humanity can work towards.

[Astreja]

You can deceive yourself, and in a sense be convinced of something false.

But knowledge would be indistinguishable from false belief, if you can truly convince yourself of a false belief.

That's why empirical evidence is so important.  Being external to the believer, it can be directly examined by others.  We can't tap into your brain and figure out why you believe something, but if you claim horses can fly you'd better have a flying horse standing nearby for us to see.

[LastPoet]

You can deceive yourself, and in a sense be convinced of something false.

But knowledge would be indistinguishable from false belief, if you can truly convince yourself of a false belief.

So close....

[Brian37]

You can deceive yourself, and in a sense be convinced of something false.

But knowledge would be indistinguishable from false belief, if you can truly convince yourself of a false belief.

That's why empirical evidence is so important.  Being external to the believer, it can be directly examined by others.  We can't tap into your brain and figure out why you believe something, but if you claim horses can fly you'd better have a flying horse standing nearby for us to see.

It's been said, in many ways, forgot who said it first. 

But something like, "Funny how the invisible and non existent are just as transparent".

God/god/gods/supernatural/deities/spirits/ghosts do not exist in reality. The exist in human imaginations as a comic book reflection of our REAL evolutionary motivation to continue.

We project our qualities in the form of non existent things because we don't want to face we are finite as a species.

I think our species would do far better to face that reality than to live a lie and start needless wars fighting over who's fantasy is real.

---

You can deceive yourself, and in a sense be convinced of something false.

But knowledge would be indistinguishable from false belief, if you can truly convince yourself of a false belief.

That's why empirical evidence is so important.  Being external to the believer, it can be directly examined by others.  We can't tap into your brain and figure out why you believe something, but if you claim horses can fly you'd better have a flying horse standing nearby for us to see.

It's been said, in many ways, forgot who said it first. 

But something like, "Funny how the invisible and non existent are just as transparent".

God/god/gods/supernatural/deities/spirits/ghosts do not exist in reality. The exist in human imaginations as a comic book reflection of our REAL evolutionary motivation to continue.

We project our qualities in the form of non existent things because we don't want to face we are finite as a species.

I think our species would do far better to face that reality than to live a lie and start needless wars fighting over who's fantasy is real.

[Mister Agenda]

I already know people can convince themselves of anything if they try hard enough, MK. That's why no one should trust that method of coming to believe something. Drich would tell you that your method ought to lead you to Christianity. And it will, if you just try hard enough to believe Christianity is the true religions. If....

[Mystic]

I already know people can convince themselves of anything if they try hard enough, MK. That's why no one should trust that method of coming to believe something. Drich would tell you that your method ought to lead you to Christianity. And it will, if you just try hard enough to believe Christianity is the true religions. If....

That is why self-honesty is critical to true knowledge and ridding oneself of ignorance. We will not arrive at truth by conjecture, and testifying to something by words is not the same as what the heart is convinced with which requires proofs and evidence but that requires honest reflection and reasoning with strength and fuel of right balanced just love.

[downbeatplumb]

I already know people can convince themselves of anything if they try hard enough, MK. That's why no one should trust that method of coming to believe something. Drich would tell you that your method ought to lead you to Christianity. And it will, if you just try hard enough to believe Christianity is the true religions. If....

That is why self-honesty is critical to true knowledge and ridding oneself of ignorance. We will not arrive at truth by conjecture, and testifying to something by words is not the same as what the heart is convinced with which requires proofs and evidence but that requires honest reflection and reasoning with strength and fuel of right balanced just love.

You seem nice MK, but honest reflection and reasoning are not evidence for god.

You can reason anything.

Here is an argument for the non-existence of time.

https://www.popsci.com/science/article/2...thing-time.

Barbour's Nows can be imagined as pages of a novel ripped from the book's spine and tossed randomly onto the floor. Each page is a separate entity existing without time, existing outside of time. Arranging the pages in some special order and moving through them in a step-by-step fashion makes a story unfold. Still, no matter how we arrange the sheets, each page is complete and independent. As Barbour says, "The cat that jumps is not the same cat that lands." The physics of reality for Barbour is the physics of these Nows taken together as a whole. There is no past moment that flows into a future moment. Instead all the different possible configurations of the universe, every possible location of every atom throughout all of creation, exist simultaneously. Barbour's Nows all exist at once in a vast Platonic realm that stands completely and absolutely without time.

Reasoning is nothing without evidence.

[Astreja]

That is why self-honesty is critical to true knowledge and ridding oneself of ignorance. We will not arrive at truth by conjecture, and testifying to something by words is not the same as what the heart is convinced with which requires proofs and evidence but that requires honest reflection and reasoning with strength and fuel of right balanced just love.

I try not to think with my heart.  It's much too busy circulating blood and I'd rather not distract it and make it lose its place.  

[JackRussell]

MK try reading LOTS of other books.

You are so wrapped up in a mindset that is circular.

Be a good young boy and get fucked up by existentialism for a week; read Beckett, Sartre or Camus, look at Dali or Magritte. Try to see the weirdness of human experience, which you are capable of, and realise no one ideology or set of books can answer anything.

Get your good brain out of the rut that it's in.

Shit, it happens to us all.