Al Franken is latest to be accused of sexual assault

[downbeatplumb]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...D-her.html

In the picture his hands are obviously not on her boobs as you can see from his left hand, but photographed to look as though they were on her boobs. A bit like when people pretend to be propping up the leaning tower of pisa.

Its not particularly funny but it does not look like assault in that photo.

[Catholic_Lady]

[quote='Minimalist' pid='1657956' dateline='1510853324']
If every man who ever copped a feel is a criminal then we all belong in jail.

My husband certainly never copped a feel. Even when we started dating, he never tried to touch private areas, or asked to, until after i gave permission.

[vorlon13]

I recall the circumstances of my last kiss from a woman. (non familial, etc)

Company Xmas party, 1992, drunk lady from my department grabeed me, gave me a big hug and planted a big wet one (no tongue) on my lips.

Unwanted? Yeah. Definitely.

Hot? Well, kinda, her husband and both of her boyfriends were smoking hotties. I suspect if she was aware of my getting off a little bit from her similar taste in big brawlin hunky menz she probably wouldn't have kissed me. I suppose the perfect adjudication for that 'assault' would be to inform her of my take on it.

And all the menz in her life . . . .

[The Grand Nudger]

Awaiting irrefutable confirmation of consent sounds a bit less than passionate.  Ultimately we all walk a tightrope in that regard....I just hope that most of us have at least some clue as to when the other wants to be touched and when they don't....or, failing that, the ability to impart upon another that their unwanted advances were immediately, truly, and deeply regrettable...and terminated swiftly.  

It can't be that damned hard.  

"Fucker! Don't touch me" seems informative.....and anyone who can drive past that in search of holy ground is a rapist waiting for a victim.

[LadyForCamus]

I was trying to be funny is at least a new excuse for sexual assault.

I give a little credit to Louis CK. He seems to be the only one who said yes, I did it, it hurt those women, I'm wrong.

Yeah, and he actually made attempts to make things right with the women on his own initiative before the story came out, even though he fully admits that there might be nothing he could do to make it up to the women.

That being said, in regards to the OP: Franken is clearly a creepo-scumbag and he should get out.

He did?  Can you link that from somewhere?  I would be interested.

---

Personally, I didn't find his apology letter particularly sincere.  It felt more like he was checking all of the perfunctory boxes in hopes of being given a second chance in the public eye at some point down the road.  The word, "manipulative" comes to mind.  It always irritates me when these guys talk about how horribly guilty they feel about what they did.  Seems they only start to feel the guilt once they get caught.  C.K. was asked about the rumors a few months ago, and he flat out denied them.  I guess it's easy to ignore all that painful remorse when you're on top of world, with everything to lose?

Did he deny It? I remember him being asked about it before and saying something to the effect of "nobody is perfect " might be a lame response still, but not exactly a denial.

I'm pretty sure he was on record denying it.  Perhaps I'm wrong?

---

If I may ask, what would a 'sincere' apology look like?

One with fewer cliches, and perhaps an actual apology, lol.  He never even wrote the words, "I'm sorry."

---

If I may ask, what would a 'sincere' apology look like?

One you make before you're caught.

This right here.  ^

---

If every man who ever copped a feel is a criminal then we all belong in jail.

Seriously, Min?  "Copping a feel" is sexual assault.

[John V]

If every man who ever copped a feel is a criminal then we all belong in jail.

Wow, just amazing.

[The Grand Nudger]

Suddenly, the right is right....and all it took was Min parroting their decades long complaint.  Who knew that he could have such a profound effect on the quality of discourse.  Somebody hand him a mic...we might be able to turn this all around before it goes over the cliff.

(a strategy emerges..we might be able to get the far right to do what we want just by having a person they hate propose we do what we don;t want done......if hitlery had been -for- free market healthcare those fuckers may have gone full single payer by now)

[FatAndFaithless]

If I may ask, what would a 'sincere' apology look like?

One with fewer cliches, and perhaps an actual apology, lol.  He never even wrote the words, "I'm sorry."

You want the literal words "i'm sorry"?  I think his statements capture pretty well that he deeply regrets his actions and is ashamed of how he hurt these women.

The hardest regret to live with is what you’ve done to hurt someone else. And I can hardly wrap my head around the scope of hurt I brought on them.

And I wielded that power irresponsibly. I have been remorseful of my actions. And I’ve tried to learn from them. And run from them. Now I’m aware of the extent of the impact of my actions. I learned yesterday the extent to which I left these women who admired me feeling badly about themselves and cautious around other men who would never have put them in that position.

He even leads off by saying straight up, that he's guilty of the accusations.  If you don't think he's actually showing remorse/apology, do you think he's saying "Yes, I did it, but I'm not sorry"?

The guy is absolutely a creep and if the women involved wanted to bring some sort of charges, or if he lost his shows, or if he was sued, I wouldn't shed a tear, but I don't know how you read an apology that takes full responsibility and shows shame for his actions as 'insincere'.  

And I agree that an apology beforehand would've been better, but by that logic then no public apology in response to any revelation could ever be sincere.

As for the 'he tried to make good with the women after the incident' thing - I think I must've heard that in one of the interviews I was watching surrounding this issue, so I can't provide a definite source for that, so you can disregard that.

[Shell B]

I've never had a guy cop a feel apologize after I told him it was unwanted. I had a much older man grab me at a concert. When I made it clear I was going to kick his ass if he kept it up, he laughed at me until my guy friend turned around. I had a guy rape kiss me (this incident is the very reason I call it rape kissing) and then tell my friend later (she was his girlfriend) that I kissed him. I had a guy kiss me and then try to go for more. When I told him no, he said "It's too late for that." There are other incidents, but most guys who are the sort to apologize if they crossed a line are the sort to wait for an invitation.

[LadyForCamus]

One with fewer cliches, and perhaps an actual apology, lol.  He never even wrote the words, "I'm sorry."

You want the literal words "i'm sorry"?  I think his statements capture pretty well that he deeply regrets his actions and is ashamed of how he hurt these women.

The hardest regret to live with is what you’ve done to hurt someone else. And I can hardly wrap my head around the scope of hurt I brought on them.

And I wielded that power irresponsibly. I have been remorseful of my actions. And I’ve tried to learn from them. And run from them. Now I’m aware of the extent of the impact of my actions. I learned yesterday the extent to which I left these women who admired me feeling badly about themselves and cautious around other men who would never have put them in that position.

He even leads off by saying straight up, that he's guilty of the accusations.  If you don't think he's actually showing remorse/apology, do you think he's saying "Yes, I did it, but I'm not sorry"?

The guy is absolutely a creep and if the women involved wanted to bring some sort of charges, or if he lost his shows, or if he was sued, I wouldn't shed a tear, but I don't know how you read an apology that takes full responsibility and shows shame for his actions as 'insincere'.  

And I agree that an apology beforehand would've been better, but by that logic then no public apology in response to any revelation could ever be sincere.

As for the 'he tried to make good with the women after the incident' thing - I think I must've heard that in one of the interviews I was watching surrounding this issue, so I can't provide a definite source for that, so you can disregard that.

I guess I can't really pin point why his letter rings so hollow to me.  I guess it reads like a script; like he's just saying all the things he knows his fans and the institution want him to say.  I honestly can't put my finger on it.  And this one really stung for me.  Louie was one of my favorites.  I want to believe he's sincerely remorseful.  But, even if he is, I still can't give him the pass that the irrational side of my brain wants to; otherwise I'm no better than Trump supporters who rationalized all those accusations and that disgusting bus audio, simply because they really, really liked him.  Louie let me down.  That's all I know.