Ohio bans doctors from performing Down Syndrome abortions

[Silver]

If I'm ever murdered in my sleep.....shrugs.....it is what it is.

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What am I going to do, perform an unrealistic The Lovely Bones rendition?

[c172]

I am glad I wasn't aborted, because I am experiencing the amazing thing that is life right now. That said, "amazing" is a term of opinion. My post, my opinion. I still support my mother's right to have aborted me if she felt like she couldn't raise me with an adequate quality of life, and do abort my brother, sister, or other if they were to be in the same situation. We don't need unwanted babies. I think in future generations (cynic that I maybe am), it'll be an issue similar to stray cats.

[Brian37]

We could care less what the right wing want to call it. It still remains that if you are not part of that decision making, between the female and the doctor, you DONT have a say. The people who want to ban it 100% of the time are NOT willing to adopt them, or pay for any medical conditions after birth, nor do they care about the quality of life of the female or baby after birth.

Then perhaps both sides are in the wrong.

"I am pro life. That means that I’m also pro social justice.

That means that I am not only for the dignity of the human being from the moment of conception, but also for the dignity of the human being until the natural end of life. For life does not end with birth. A person who is truly pro life is pro all life, pro every stage of life, pro every stage of life for every person. For all human life is sacred, because it is created by God.

That means that I support anything that helps a person live a full, healthy and satisfying life, in every part of the world. So I am for care for the poor, for a living wage, for affordable health care, for adequate housing, for a humane work environment, for equal pay for women, for generous child care, for the support of the aged and the infirm.

That means I support caring for the marginalized among us: the refugee, the immigrant, the displaced person, the homeless, the unemployed, the person with disabilities, the single mother, women who are abused, minorities of every kind who are persecuted, and all those who feel left out, mocked, lonely, ignored or frightened.

That means that I am against torture, because it is an affront to human dignity. I am against the death penalty, the most serious affront to an adult life. I am against abuse and mistreatment in prisons. I am against war as a way to solve problems.

That means I respect the lives of all creatures, and am therefore for the care of the world in which we live, for the environment in the broadest sense.

That means I am pro peace, pro justice and pro reconciliation.

The longer I am a Jesuit, the longer I am a priest, the longer I live, and the more I pray and listen and observe, the more convinced I am of the sanctity and beauty of life.

So, yes, I am pro life. Pro all life. I hope you are too."

-Father James Martin

I can't further participate in this thread.

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A) Twenty weeks is not too late. The foetus is not viable outside the womb. That viability figure hasn't budged since the UK set 24 weeks as the limit in the 60s. B) The video is from a fundie anti-abortion group well known and notorious for doctoring and releasing faked videos. This is the group after all which made and released the lying videos accusing PP of selling tissues of aborted foetuses.

Tell yourself that's not how a 20 week baby is aborted, if it makes you feel better about supporting it. I went to nursing school. That's how it's done.

CL, I AM PRO mind your own business. I am pro QUALITY of life after birth. That means in order to effectively take care of kids so they don't end up in unstable conditions, THE CLIMATE of society as a WHOLE allows parents to be home to monitor what their children do. Outside that, it is CRUEL to females especially if their lives are at risk, to demand they give birth.

I gave you a practical way of reducing abortions. Banning them will only put more lives at risk. 

The far right are not trying to ban abortions out of any compassionate reason. It is SOLELY a bullshit religion excuse to control bodies they don't own the same way Muslims make women dress in tents. 

NOBODY on our side is throwing a party when females get to the point of considering one. I think you know me well enough over the years you have known me to know I am not a monster. I AM NOT your enemy and you know that. 


THE BEST WAY to REDUCE, and that is all you can do in reality, the best way to reduce abortions is to empower females and families economically and education wise. But you will NOT get rid if it PERIOD. Let the doctor and female decide outside that.

[Amarok]

1. There is a difference between not having a conscience yet  and  being in a different state of  an already existent conscience . So this fails . 

2. If my slumber was violating someone else's  body . Then i would not begrudge them for killing me . 

3. This sounds like the tired "would you like to have liked to been aborted " If the price of my birth is the endangerment of women and the loss of their reproductive say . Then my life is not worth it . 

4. Yup a fetus is parasitic tissue . That does not mean you cannot miss it.

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Then perhaps both sides are in the wrong.

"I am pro life. That means that I’m also pro social justice.

That means that I am not only for the dignity of the human being from the moment of conception, but also for the dignity of the human being until the natural end of life. For life does not end with birth. A person who is truly pro life is pro all life, pro every stage of life, pro every stage of life for every person. For all human life is sacred, because it is created by God.

That means that I support anything that helps a person live a full, healthy and satisfying life, in every part of the world. So I am for care for the poor, for a living wage, for affordable health care, for adequate housing, for a humane work environment, for equal pay for women, for generous child care, for the support of the aged and the infirm.

That means I support caring for the marginalized among us: the refugee, the immigrant, the displaced person, the homeless, the unemployed, the person with disabilities, the single mother, women who are abused, minorities of every kind who are persecuted, and all those who feel left out, mocked, lonely, ignored or frightened.

That means that I am against torture, because it is an affront to human dignity. I am against the death penalty, the most serious affront to an adult life. I am against abuse and mistreatment in prisons. I am against war as a way to solve problems.

That means I respect the lives of all creatures, and am therefore for the care of the world in which we live, for the environment in the broadest sense.

That means I am pro peace, pro justice and pro reconciliation.

The longer I am a Jesuit, the longer I am a priest, the longer I live, and the more I pray and listen and observe, the more convinced I am of the sanctity and beauty of life.

So, yes, I am pro life. Pro all life. I hope you are too."

-Father James Martin

I can't further participate in this thread.

---

Tell yourself that's not how a 20 week baby is aborted, if it makes you feel better about supporting it. I went to nursing school. That's how it's done.

CL, I AM PRO mind your own business. I am pro QUALITY of life after birth. That means in order to effectively take care of kids so they don't end up in unstable conditions, THE CLIMATE of society as a WHOLE allows parents to be home to monitor what their children do. Outside that, it is CRUEL to females especially if their lives are at risk, to demand they give birth.

I gave you a practical way of reducing abortions. Banning them will only put more lives at risk. 

The far right are not trying to ban abortions out of any compassionate reason. It is SOLELY a bullshit religion excuse to control bodies they don't own the same way Muslims make women dress in tents. 

NOBODY on our side is throwing a party when females get to the point of considering one. I think you know me well enough over the years you have known me to know I am not a monster. I AM NOT your enemy and you know that. 


THE BEST WAY to REDUCE, and that is all you can do in reality, the best way to reduce abortions is to empower females and families economically and education wise. But you will NOT get rid if it PERIOD. Let the doctor and female decide outside that.

Indeed abortion bans DO NOTHING !!!!

[A Theist]

We could care less what the right wing want to call it. It still remains that if you are not part of that decision making, between the female and the doctor, you DONT have a say. The people who want to ban it 100% of the time are NOT willing to adopt them, or pay for any medical conditions after birth, nor do they care about the quality of life of the female or baby after birth.

Then perhaps both sides are in the wrong.

"I am pro life. That means that I’m also pro social justice.

That means that I am not only for the dignity of the human being from the moment of conception, but also for the dignity of the human being until the natural end of life. For life does not end with birth. A person who is truly pro life is pro all life, pro every stage of life, pro every stage of life for every person. For all human life is sacred, because it is created by God.

That means that I support anything that helps a person live a full, healthy and satisfying life, in every part of the world. So I am for care for the poor, for a living wage, for affordable health care, for adequate housing, for a humane work environment, for equal pay for women, for generous child care, for the support of the aged and the infirm.

That means I support caring for the marginalized among us: the refugee, the immigrant, the displaced person, the homeless, the unemployed, the person with disabilities, the single mother, women who are abused, minorities of every kind who are persecuted, and all those who feel left out, mocked, lonely, ignored or frightened.

That means that I am against torture, because it is an affront to human dignity. I am against the death penalty, the most serious affront to an adult life. I am against abuse and mistreatment in prisons. I am against war as a way to solve problems.

That means I respect the lives of all creatures, and am therefore for the care of the world in which we live, for the environment in the broadest sense.

That means I am pro peace, pro justice and pro reconciliation.

The longer I am a Jesuit, the longer I am a priest, the longer I live, and the more I pray and listen and observe, the more convinced I am of the sanctity and beauty of life.

So, yes, I am pro life. Pro all life. I hope you are too."

-Father James Martin

I can't further participate in this thread.

---

A) Twenty weeks is not too late. The foetus is not viable outside the womb. That viability figure hasn't budged since the UK set 24 weeks as the limit in the 60s. B) The video is from a fundie anti-abortion group well known and notorious for doctoring and releasing faked videos. This is the group after all which made and released the lying videos accusing PP of selling tissues of aborted foetuses.

Tell yourself that's not how a 20 week baby is aborted, if it makes you feel better about supporting it. I went to nursing school. That's how it's done.

The unborn at 15 - 20 weeks in the womb...what mothers are to expect at this term, half way through her pregnancy




Between 21 - 27 weeks. Third Trimester




An unborn dismembered by abortion at 21 weeks

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Moderator Notice
Edited to add hide tags

[Brian37]

1. There is a difference between not having a conscience yet  and  being in a different state of  an already existent conscience . So this fails . 

2. If my slumber was violating someone else's  body . Then i would not begrudge them for killing me . 

3. This sounds like the tired "would you like to have liked to been aborted " If the price of my birth is the endangerment of women and the loss of their reproductive say . Then my life is not worth it . 

4. Yup a fetus is parasitic tissue . That does not mean you cannot miss it.

The other horrible logic from religion is thinking we are the apex of evolution, or special to life. Somehow theists stupidly think that when we say we are ONE of billions of species, that we are saying life is meaningless. THAT IS NOT what we are saying.

In a perfect world every baby would be healthy and wanted, and taken care of after birth. BUT we don't live in a perfect world. I feel very lucky even with all the problems in my life how it has gone so far. But no, I would not want to be born brain damaged, or be born into an abusive home to the  point I might grow up to be a serial killer, nor would I want to be born into conditions of starving or war. 

The reality for all life, including humans, it is still a crap shoot and all you can do is seek to reduce potential harm. Religion chases a impossible utopia. But it is a fucking myth that we are heartless or lack the desire to want to improve the human condition. We would love every baby healthy and wanted and stable, but we don't want religion bullying society. 

EDUCATION and ECONOMICS and allowing more home time for parents. THAT IS THE LONG TERM SOLUTION but again, you can only seek to reduce the conditions but you will never get rid of it by doing what religion wants.

[Silver]

Yummy!

[I_am_not_mafia]

Even when I was of childbearing age I had neither the desire nor the patience to raise a handicapped child. You are at liberty to call this selfishness; it is, however, the unvarnished truth and I make no apologies for it. If I had been compelled by the state to give birth to a child that I knew was afflicted by an incurable condition, I would immediately give that child up for adoption so that the state would be forced to foot the bill for raising the child.

What if your child suffered a debilitating life long injury at some point after they were already born? Would you say you'd turn them over to the state then too?

With that being said, there are adoption agencies specifically for special needs babies. There are many people out there wanting to adopt them. Contrary to popular belief, disabled people are not worthless or unwanted.

The difference is that unlike a fetus, a child is conscious and intelligent.

Having a baby is as selfish as aborting a fetus. Both are done to improve one's own life.

[LadyForCamus]

God, that’s horrible. 😞.  I’m pro-choice, but twenty weeks is too late.  I support bans on twenty week abortions unless there is an immediate danger to mother and/or baby.  I mean, where do we/should we draw the line?  And, why does this guy sound so proud of him self?!

A) Twenty weeks is not too late. The foetus is not viable outside the womb. That viability figure hasn't budged since the UK set 24 weeks as the limit in the 60s. B) The video is from a fundie anti-abortion group well known and notorious for doctoring and releasing faked videos. This is the group after all which made and released the lying videos accusing PP of selling tissues of aborted foetuses.

https://www.babycentre.co.uk/20-weeks-pregnant

Sorry guys, but this is a baby.  20 weeks is half way through the pregnancy.  The fetus can move, suck its thumb, taste amniotic fluid, and hear mom’s voice.  It is my opinion, from a moral perspective, that 20 weeks is too late to say, ‘eh, I’ve changhed my mind.’

[Silver]

Don't you know the female golden rule?

I always reserve the right to change my mind.