Civility subsection suggestion

[vulcanlogician]

I like the idea, and it could work... not by mod enforcement, but rather by self-policing from users. Maybe it should be packaged as "Questions for Atheists" or some such thing (rather than a "no no zone") and would have its home in the introduction forum where new members would likely see it along with a descriptor of the intent that it is a place where more civil interactions might transpire. "Questions for Atheists" would immediately signal that this is a subforum designed for theists who want to inquire about a different point of view, and not a place for us heathens to draw our line in the sand.

I imagine the only occasional problem would be hotheaded theist trolls or socks  posting "troll question" threads, (ie. "How are you going to cool down when you are burning in Hell?") so the descriptor of the subforum should indicate that this is disallowed (along with mockery from nonbelievers).

My only reservation is that sometimes innocuous questions can lead to vigorous and forceful debates. And these debates can be quite fun and informative. Perhaps the descriptor should also invite users of the subforum to open a new thread elsewhere should such contention arise.

Meh, it could work... and even if it couldn't, I like what motivates the idea.

[Tiberius]

I can see us having a trial period, like Steel said, with a subset of approved members. If it doesn't cause too much overhead we could continue it. To be honest, we probably need to recruit a few more staff members anyway.

[Fireball]

The religious position is considered nonsensical by most atheists, and given the kind of arrant stupidity that accompanies apologistic arguments here and elsewhere, I for one can easily understand the hostility. It's the reason I don't generally participate in that debate-I don't generally treat nonsense, no matter how truly believed, with any credence. It's sickening to me to see a person's logical reasoning subverted by religious indoctrination into some of the tripe we see here. I'm really pleased to be living in these times, despite the crap we see going on, because it was WAY worse in times past when the RCC held sway. If such a forum were made, it will eventually fizzle. Just look at every online argument between some religious shikepoke (WLC comes to mind) and any atheist. There is only a handful of people here who could argue that eloquently, and the religious we see here aren't of that caliber. The religious argument boils down to "You just gotta believe", and that's a sorry comment on a person's reasoning ability, which should garner exactly ZERO respect with the rest of humanity.

[shadow]

I like the idea, and it could work... not by mod enforcement, but rather by self-policing from users. Maybe it should be packaged as "Questions for Atheists" or some such thing (rather than a "no no zone") and would have its home in the introduction forum where new members would likely see it along with a descriptor of the intent that it is a place where more civil interactions might transpire. "Questions for Atheists" would immediately signal that this is a subforum designed for theists who want to inquire about a different point of view, and not a place for us heathens to draw our line in the sand.

I imagine the only occasional problem would be hotheaded theist trolls or socks  posting "troll question" threads, (ie. "How are you going to cool down when you are burning in Hell?") so the descriptor of the subforum should indicate that this is disallowed (along with mockery from nonbelievers).

My only reservation is that sometimes innocuous questions can lead to vigorous and forceful debates. And these debates can be quite fun and informative. Perhaps the descriptor should also invite users of the subforum to open a new thread elsewhere should such contention arise.

Meh, it could work... and even if it couldn't, I like what motivates the idea.

I don't think vigorous and forceful debates cannot occur in a civil setting. In fact, I would argue that CL's descriptors of "no insults, no mocking, no off topic posts," actually improve the quality of a debate - it's not usually a lack of insult or mockery that ends discussion.

And I don't think it would just be a 'theists vs atheists' section. I for one sometimes don't agree with the majority of atheists here, and would appreciate a setting where I could discuss my opinions without a portion of people defaulting to easy surface ridicule instead of attempting to understand the argument.

Self-policing from users is correct in my opinion, so perhaps in terms of moderation it would just require users being approved to post or not, and the losing that ability entirely if they were clearly misusing the subforum.

[I_am_not_mafia]

Haven't read the thread but it seems like a way for theists to reclaim the respect and deference for their beliefs that they are used to in the real world. Fuck that. The value of these forums is that it allows atheists the chance to speak their minds when they may have to hide it in their everyday lives.

[robvalue]

I think it could work, unless people expect special privileges for any religious beliefs they bring up.

[Homeless Nutter]

I think it would be a great idea - a civil section for adults discussing serious topics. One small addition to the rules, though - nobody is allowed to mention gods. I think it would be relatively easy to police such a rule - definitely easier than differentiating between "honest" religious arguments and mockery - and would certainly cut down on the amount of "slinging BS". And this is an atheist forum after all - very few of us consider religious matters "a serious topic".

Because you know how that will end otherwise - every nonsensical stream of consciousness of every deluded theist, every proselytizing rant about how "love is light, god is nice, and [insert a tome of barbarian poetry] is a science book" will end up there. Not to mention Little Rik...

[robvalue]

I think it would be a great idea - a civil section for adults discussing serious topics. One small addition to the rules, though - nobody is allowed to mention gods. I think it would be relatively easy to police such a rule - definitely easier than differentiating between "honest" religious arguments and mockery - and would certainly cut down on the amount of "slinging BS". And this is an atheist forum after all - very few of us consider religious matters "a serious topic".

Because you know how that will end otherwise - every nonsensical stream of consciousness of every deluded theist, every proselytizing rant about how "love is light, god is nice, and [insert a tome of barbarian poetry] is a science book" will end up there. Not to mention Little Rik...

I think that would be a great idea. It would pre-empt most of the problems.

TTA have a "help and support" section where civility is required, and it works well. Of course, rambling on about gods doesn't happen there.

If a particular theist is that obsessed with God and religion that the rest of the forum doesn't suffice, and their beliefs are that precious that they think they need special protection, I think they should head to a theist forum instead.

[GrandizerII]

I can see us having a trial period, like Steel said, with a subset of approved members. If it doesn't cause too much overhead we could continue it. To be honest, we probably need to recruit a few more staff members anyway.

Ok, I'm calling it. A popular Christian member is going to be moderator here soon ...

[Edwardo Piet]

I can see us having a trial period, like Steel said, with a subset of approved members. If it doesn't cause too much overhead we could continue it. To be honest, we probably need to recruit a few more staff members anyway.

By the way... I know I am far less than civil on the rest of the forum but I think you would perhaps be rather surprised that I'd find it very easy to be civil in a subforum where the rules actually require civility. So I hope I would get the approval.

I mean, I hope I would be allowed to participate there.

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Because you know how that will end otherwise - every nonsensical stream of consciousness of every deluded theist, every proselytizing rant about how "love is light, god is nice, and [insert a tome of barbarian poetry] is a science book" will end up there. Not to mention Little Rik...

Uhhhh it all ends up there anyway.

With or without us being rude to theists they're gonna express their crazy ideas anyway.

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I can see us having a trial period, like Steel said, with a subset of approved members. If it doesn't cause too much overhead we could continue it. To be honest, we probably need to recruit a few more staff members anyway.

Ok, I'm calling it. A popular Christian member is going to be moderator here soon ...

Please God no.

As lovely as some people are... that doesn't make them suited for moderator lol.

I'd happily become part of the staff myself again but I don't think I'm considered "mature" enough (despite the fact I haven't changed one bit and I was always told in the past that I was a great moderator).

Although I could be wrong! Maybe they would welcome me back someday. After all I was always told I could come back whenever I wanted. Although I've asked a few times and been completely ignored so I guess they changed their mind on that even though the whole reason I was retired from staff is no longer relevant (I couldn't get along with another staff member so one of us had to leave... and I volunteered to because I said they are better at the job than I am. But I am getting along with them well again now so the whole reason I left doesn't apply anymore).

I dunno... AF seems to have changed a lot. I certainly haven't

What I really miss is being able to fix quotes when I see all these broken quote boxes from people around the forums. It frustrates me so much when I see all that and can't correct it lol.