Can God love?

[Drich]

To those who build their homes on the sand yes! To other's God rains down all manner of blessing and riches.

More realistically, they are illogically attributing life to god.

and of those who do not? meaning what do you say about those in whom God has given far more than what their education or statio of life could ever afford them?

[Foxaèr]

More realistically, they are illogically attributing life to god.

and of those who do not? meaning what do you say about those in whom God has given far more than what their education or statio of life could ever afford them?

God is not giving anyone anything. Theists are merely illogically attributing their "good" or "lucky" lives to a being that does not exist.

[robvalue]

It's funny how people from different religions all get "benefits"; even though they claim, at the same time, that this can't be possible.

[Angrboda]

I'm going to let you, Steve and Drich, have the last word on this.

[Drich]

well one, I don't know anyone who would disagree that God could do anything He wants to do. again.. that is the definition of alpha and omega.

The omnipotence paradox is a family of paradoxes that arise with some understandings of the term 'omnipotent'. The paradox arises, for example, if one assumes that an omnipotent being has no limits and is capable of realizing any outcome, even logically contradictory ideas such as creating square circles. A no-limits understanding of omnipotence such as this has been rejected by theologians from Thomas Aquinas to contemporary philosophers of religion, such as Alvin Plantinga.

Wikipedia || Omnipotence paradox

but again the Alpha and Omega is the truest form of omnipotence. It is not the form the wiki page describes as to fall into that form that God must be all powerful all the time. As I pointed out true power of being what He describes as the alpha and omega allows God to be as strong or as weak as He deems it necessary, freeing him from the confines of the R/C doctrine that defines your wiki page version of omnipotence.

Can God create a stone so heave he can not lift it? an omni max God is stuck while an alpha and omega does whatever he wants.. Can he create a stone that heavy? yes if he wanted to no if he does not.

---

and of those who do not? meaning what do you say about those in whom God has given far more than what their education or statio of life could ever afford them?

God is not giving anyone anything.  Theists are merely illogically attributing their "good" or "lucky" lives to a being that does not exist.

I beg to differ.

Everything I have is a gift from God.

It's not luck. you are awarded 2 US patents by being lucky. those patents are not then bought and put into production because you are full of good fortune. Mind you I'm the one who could read past a 4th grade level upon 'graduation.' Math was equally a mystery. My first job was a janitor at a tire shop, because they thought running the tire machines (typically held over for pot heads and recovering meth addicts) was too complicated for me. From then till now still no school or formal training. learned how to read from comic book/taught me how to visualize the words into literal pictures. once I could picture something I owned it. I could take anything apart and put it back together. Now God interjects those pictures. like for instance my first patent.

I was brought onto a project that has involved a prior 6 month collaboration between a military batter company and a italian refrigeration company trying to make an all electric unit. the problem is they could not get the battery technology to direct power and communicate with the italian refrigeration system. I the first 15 minutes as the two engineer teams (the american side had former nasa guys and the italians had their equivalent here they are asking me a franchise holder for the refrigeration company who has had no schooling what I thought/most of them thought I was a joke) but as they were laying out the problems I had alread deduced the problem and God gave me a picture of the solution. and i literally out of a vacuum wrote down what I saw electronically into a rudimentary diagram and as the first team ended their list of complaints I handed the lead engineer my paper. It had a list of perceived problems and the wiring solution. no crazy electronics just switch and relay. the engineers originally booked at the idea then I walked them through everything. we made several small changes to accommodate lighting and switch configuration. 

The Head us guy said it would take 100's of thousands of dollars to prototype nd a year of testing. thanks but no thanks. Then God put a list of all the items I needed in my head most of which I could get from a air force surplus electronic store we have locally. I piped up and said I could do this for 500 bucks and a weekend. The owner of the company produced 500 as a bet that I couldn't do it. meaning I had till monday to get the prototype working from a late friday meeting. The italian engineers offered to help I told them to have a nice weekend at disney, but the project lead stayed he said he would not interfere at all just need to watch. so from the meeting we went to the store spent about 300 of the 500 and went back to my shop where I put the whole thing together over a late friday and all day saturday. it ran all saturday night and sunday. we then drove the truck over to a meeting with the remaining engineers and showed them that we could in fact run a 230/3/20 amp truck on battery power for 4 continuous hours then when plugged in sense the polarity and charge itself. then I told them I could double the efficiency (give them 8 hours for 1000 dollars more) they wrote me a check I promptly order a 75.00 part changed the refrigerat and the oil to a mid grade gas, and it pulled to temp twice as fast and ran on the same batteries for almost 8 hours continually. They could not believe it. they all thought it was impossible. so then they tested the system for a month no faults which is absolutely unheard of so the sold 5 to test market in NYC home food distributor who was being fined a million dollars a WEEK because the refrigeration systems they were using were breaking the noise/time restrictions in manhattan.

So they bought 5 to test run. they sent them over to the local dealer, he could not figure it out. so they sent the battery guys, and they insisted that I be apart of their crew. I went over for 5 days and got 4 units running. they ran without problem for 1 year. then that company order 25 more... which at that project was sold and I got my end and that's the last I heard of it.

So the total cost was 375 if your keeping count. at the end I told the guys this and they said money well spent/keep it.

None of that was me. you know when something like that is yours and when it just appears from nothing. this one deal totally changed my life and my company. I've had several other like this. and I know it was all well beyond my scope.

No one like you will ever convince me there is no god and He does not give His children gifts. I've met the deity and i have been given far more than I've every deserve. again just one example, and if you want to come to orlando to vet my story I can take you to all the places and people mentioned.

[Drich]

It's funny how people from different religions all get "benefits"; even though they claim, at the same time, that this can't be possible.

because they are not benefits as you see them. they are means to an end another responsibility another 'test' to mke you ready for the next level.

I started my business it was just me and I could even afford to pay my wife part time. so she worked for free off the books. then I was privy to 'lots of benefits' which required lots of works self sacrifice pain and loss. which prompted me for the next level of hard work, pain and loss. and so on it goes. Yes there is benefit, but in the end you know none of this belongs to you and can be ask back at any moment. why because you are a servant, not one being serviced by a genie.

[Succubus]

It's not luck. you are awarded 2 US patents by being lucky.

Drich, could you provide details of those patents, PM if you prefer.

those patents are not then bought and put into production because you are full of good fortune. Mind you I'm the one who could read past a 4th grade level upon 'graduation.' Math was equally a mystery. My first job was a janitor at a tire shop, because they thought running the tire machines (typically held over for pot heads and recovering meth addicts) was too complicated for me. From then till now still no school or formal training. learned how to read from comic book/taught me how to visualize the words into literal pictures. once I could picture something I owned it. I could take anything apart and put it back together. Now God interjects those pictures. like for instance my first patent.

Drich, are you autistic to any degree?

<Superfluous stuff snipped>

...so from the meeting we went to the store spent about 300 of the 500 and went back to my shop where I put the whole thing together over a late friday and all day saturday. it ran all saturday night and sunday. we then drove the truck over to a meeting with the remaining engineers and showed them that we could in fact run a 230/3/20 amp truck on battery power for 4 continuous hours then when plugged in sense the polarity and charge itself.

You reinvented the wheel. What you've described here is an off the shelf voltage inverter.

Some clarification please.
When you say it ran all Saturday night and Sunday this was on mains power, yes?
By '230/3/20' I take it you mean the US system of using two 115V lives to give 230V? The '20' I take it is the amperage?

20 amps x 230 volts = 4.6Kw.
4.6Kw is about right for a refrigeration truck. But now reverse the calculation.
For the inverter output of 4.6Kw it needs 190 amps @24volts from the battery.
190 amps over four hours which you later extended to eight hours? This is not taking inverter losses into account. How big is this battery?

then I told them I could double the efficiency (give them 8 hours for 1000 dollars more)

No, I'm not having it.

they wrote me a check I promptly order a 75.00 part changed the refrigerat and the oil to a mid grade gas, and it pulled to temp twice as fast and ran on the same batteries for almost 8 hours continually. They could not believe it.

Neither can I.
The $75 part would be for the expansion valve and you changed the oil from a mineral oil to a synthetic polyolester oil. Mid grade gas??? This is new to me. You mean the HFC refrigerant was pulled out and replaced with an HCFC or an HFO?
This is the reason for switching to synthetic oil, mineral oil in a HCFC system turns to glue and the system is fubar. So far so good.
What did you pull out, R134a, R404a? What did you replace it with, R513a?

Not that it matters. You claim to have pulled to temp twice as fast and at the same time doubled the battery life. You didn't double the efficiency you quadrupled it! And you did all this with the same compressor, the same condenser and the same evaporator? How come in all my years as a refrigeration technician I haven't encountered this remarkable development?    

Laws of thermodynamics says... NO!

<Snip>

so the sold 5 to test market in NYC home food distributor who was being fined a million dollars a WEEK because the refrigeration systems they were using were breaking the noise/time restrictions in manhattan.

Rubbish. Decent Carrier or Sanyo truck mounted systems are pretty quiet.

So the total cost was 375 if your keeping count. at the end I told the guys this and they said money well spent/keep it.

This development of yours should have made you a billionaire overnight. Did it?

...if you want to come to orlando to vet my story I can take you to all the places and people mentioned.

No, just show me the patents.

[I_am_not_mafia]

I'm wondering if there is something about theistic conditioning that makes believers re-write history in their mind. Drich is doing it here and I've seen him do it before. But rather than just think that it's a characteristic of Drich, I'm wondering if it's a habit theists fall into because they learn to attribute everything to their god. The reason I am wondering this is because I met up with my religionist brother recently and found out that he had manipulated me into helping him write his xtian propaganda to give to atheists. He originally told me that his essay was for a discussion forum so I gave him enough advice so that atheists would actually read it and discuss it. But then I found out that he was turning it into a booklet and he claimed that it was always intended to be the case. Which is clearly bullshit because he kept telling me that it's meant to be controversial, but why hand over a booklet which will just immensely piss off the receiver? But he seems to believe his new version of history. He's never been manipulative in the past so this took me by surprise. As far as I'm concerned I can't trust him again. It did piss me off though because I am morally opposed to deliberately spreading of ignorance.

Religion is a foul insidious thing.

[emjay]

It's funny how people from different religions all get "benefits"; even though they claim, at the same time, that this can't be possible.

because they are not benefits as you see them. they are means to an end another responsibility another 'test' to mke you ready for the next level.

I started my business it was just me and I could even afford to pay my wife part time. so she worked for free off the books. then I was privy to 'lots of benefits' which required lots of works self sacrifice pain and loss. which prompted me for the next level of hard work, pain and loss. and so on it goes. Yes there is benefit, but in the end you know none of this belongs to you and can be ask back at any moment. why because you are a servant, not one being serviced by a genie.

Interesting story above. IMO you don't give yourself enough credit for your achievements... IMO it was your own determination, ingenuity, and intuition that has led to the success of your business and inventions. And you're always saying you didn't do well at school but so what? Some people are better with their hands. And the fact that you self-taught yourself loads of stuff only shows more your determination... something to be admired.

And I can't remember exactly what you said but it was a friend? of yours that gave you some money, which you saw as an answer to prayer and/or prophecy? Did he give it to you as a gift or was he investing in your business? Either way I think this time you're not giving your friend enough credit... if you attribute it to God. My guess is he saw your potential and determination... like if you went on The Apprentice with the attitude and determination you've described, I bet Alan Sugar would snap you up in a heartbeat.

Not to mention I can't see how you can attribute the actions of your friend to God anyway, given that he gave it to you out of his own free will which, under your system, God doesn't mess with. And as for your innovations, did you understand the ideas that came to you? If you did, that just shows subconscious intuition in progress... your brain working behind the scenes putting the pieces together, ready for a light bulb moment.

IMO it's all you.

[I_am_not_mafia]

Interesting story above. IMO you don't give yourself enough credit for your achievements... IMO it was your own determination, ingenuity, and intuition that has led to the success of your business and inventions. And you're always saying you didn't do well at school but so what? Some people are better with their hands. And the fact that you self-taught yourself loads of stuff only shows more your determination... something to be admired.

And I can't remember exactly what you said but it was a friend? of yours that gave you some money, which you saw as an answer to prayer and/or prophecy? Did he give it to you as a gift or was he investing in your business? Either way I think this time you're not giving your friend enough credit... if you attribute it to God. My guess is he saw your potential and determination... like if you went on The Apprentice with the attitude and determination you've described, I bet Alan Sugar would snap you up in a heartbeat.

Not to mention I can't see how you can attribute the actions of your friend to God anyway, given that he gave it to you out of his own free will which, under your system, God doesn't mess with. And as for your innovations, did you understand the ideas that came to you? If you did, that just shows subconscious intuition in progress... your brain working behind the scenes putting the pieces together, ready for a light bulb moment.

IMO it's all you.

A perfect example of how religion is a parasite.