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RE: Prayers don't work so why do religious keep jabbing at it?
August 9, 2019 at 4:40 am
(August 9, 2019 at 3:03 am)Anomalocaris Wrote: (August 9, 2019 at 2:59 am)Haipule Wrote: It's funny that even Jesus' "The Lord's Prayer" is little understood. What we can't see in English is the imperative mood(command, strong entreaty) He uses. He didn't say, " give us this day". He absolutely commanded it! He demanded it! And, He always spoke to God as and equal!
Is it little wonder why I posted on a Christian web forum that I commanded of God, and demanded of Him, a week before the predicted arrival of the first hurricane Mathew in 2016, that He kick it back out to sea?
I woke up at 7:30am, the day of it's predicted arrival, to find that the computer models had a CAT 4 headed right up my ass in Palm Beach County FL! Remember, I said that pray/demand/command a week before.
My wife and I prepared our central room to hunker down, a closet. It was supposed to hit at 1:30pm. At 1:00 I grabbed a drink and a cigar and went outside to awaited the arrival. It never came. So, I went to the news and found that that storm did the sweetest little dance around Palm Beach County FL and went back out to sea. You really think I was "lucky"?
No. You are damned unlucky to be this delusional. We have had a good time to date. I admire you Sir! Really? I'm delusional? My life is an historical fact Sir--fact! I give you one anecdotal fact! Well how many do you think I have? Eventually, it's not just merely a anecdotal story is it? I agree that I'm a freak and there are many who will agree with you. But non will disagree that I am a freak. Or, that I exist. The mere fact that I exist is not anecdotal--it is a fact, as well as, my unbelievable life, real or imagined by you! Who cares what you think!
My girlfriend thinks I'm a stalker. Well...she's not my girlfriend "yet".
I discovered a new vitamin that fights cancer. I call it ...B9
I also invented a diet pill. It works great but had to quit taking it because of the side effects. Turns out my penis is larger and my hair grew back. And whoa! If you think my hair is nice!
When does size truly matter? When it's TOO big!
I'm currently working on a new pill I call "Destenze". However...now my shoes don't fit.
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RE: Prayers don't work so why do religious keep jabbing at it?
August 9, 2019 at 5:02 am
(This post was last modified: August 9, 2019 at 5:02 am by ReptilianPeon.)
The Wikipedia article should list all of the major studies. There have been multiple. Prayer is apparently as effective as random chance.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Studies_on...ory_prayer
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RE: Prayers don't work so why do religious keep jabbing at it?
August 9, 2019 at 6:59 am
The plural form of anecdote is not evidence, Haipule.
Whole lotta folks see Elvis, too.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Prayers don't work so why do religious keep jabbing at it?
August 9, 2019 at 7:35 am
(August 9, 2019 at 4:34 am)Belaqua Wrote: (August 9, 2019 at 2:38 am)Anomalocaris Wrote: A more self deceived man is apparently deemed a better man.
Normally we don't think of Kierkegaard as someone who advocates self-deception.
Granted, any kind of human thinking can result in us fooling ourselves. But why do you think prayer -- of the kind Kierkegaard recommends -- is going to lead to "a more self deceived man"?
Without hearing your reasoning it sounds a bit as though you were begging the question.
Who is "we" and why do the "we" think that their opinion is more valuable/valid?
That quote is a statement, I don't see a recommendation. And "change the nature" is definitely open to interpretation.
Being told you're delusional does not necessarily mean you're mental.
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RE: Prayers don't work so why do religious keep jabbing at it?
August 9, 2019 at 7:50 am
(This post was last modified: August 9, 2019 at 7:52 am by Belacqua.)
(August 9, 2019 at 7:35 am)wyzas Wrote: Who is "we" and why do the "we" think that their opinion is more valuable/valid?
Sorry, I wasn't clear.
By "we" I mean people who have read Kierkegaard. I think that on the subject of his writings, people who have read them have a more valuable opinion than people who haven't read them.
Quote:That quote is a statement, I don't see a recommendation. And "change the nature" is definitely open to interpretation.
True, the quote doesn't contain everything he had to say. The recommendations are elsewhere. Since Anomalocaris had a very strong opinion about what Kierkegaard said, I thought he probably knew more than that quote. Maybe not.
"Change the nature of" is indeed open to interpretation. This doesn't mean that it doesn't happen.
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RE: Prayers don't work so why do religious keep jabbing at it?
August 9, 2019 at 8:04 am
(August 9, 2019 at 6:59 am)Gae Bolga Wrote: The plural form of anecdote is not evidence, Haipule.
Whole lotta folks see Elvis, too.
...or maybe it was Jesus, you know they kind of look the same...
Don Henley
If you get to thinking you’re a person of some influence, try ordering somebody else’s dog around.
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RE: Prayers don't work so why do religious keep jabbing at it?
August 9, 2019 at 8:06 am
(This post was last modified: August 9, 2019 at 8:22 am by Anomalocaris.)
(August 9, 2019 at 4:34 am)Belaqua Wrote: (August 9, 2019 at 2:38 am)Anomalocaris Wrote: A more self deceived man is apparently deemed a better man.
Normally we don't think of Kierkegaard as someone who advocates self-deception.
Granted, any kind of human thinking can result in us fooling ourselves. But why do you think prayer -- of the kind Kierkegaard recommends -- is going to lead to "a more self deceived man"?
Without hearing your reasoning it sounds a bit as though you were begging the question.
Because it generally wouldn’t be considered a prayer if it didn’t rely to some degree on belief out of proportion to evidence that one is communicating certain selected and formatted information to outside entity in the expectation of soliciting certain response through the prayer. If that were not an element of the prayer, then perhaps few would have called it prayer rather than just meditation.
In many cases, the prayer is self deceptive at more than that one layer. It is also self-deceptive in that the hopes of the prayer often contradicts the alleged nature of the supposed outside entity.
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RE: Prayers don't work so why do religious keep jabbing at it?
August 9, 2019 at 8:08 am
(August 9, 2019 at 7:50 am)Belaqua Wrote: (August 9, 2019 at 7:35 am)wyzas Wrote: Who is "we" and why do the "we" think that their opinion is more valuable/valid?
Sorry, I wasn't clear.
By "we" I mean people who have read Kierkegaard. I think that on the subject of his writings, people who have read them have a more valuable opinion than people who haven't read them.
Quote:That quote is a statement, I don't see a recommendation. And "change the nature" is definitely open to interpretation.
True, the quote doesn't contain everything he had to say. The recommendations are elsewhere. Since Anomalocaris had a very strong opinion about what Kierkegaard said, I thought he probably knew more than that quote. Maybe not.
"Change the nature of" is indeed open to interpretation. This doesn't mean that it doesn't happen.
And it doesn't mean that the change needs to be considered as positive.
Being told you're delusional does not necessarily mean you're mental.
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RE: Prayers don't work so why do religious keep jabbing at it?
August 9, 2019 at 8:38 am
I think many people do it because they lack any other means to help the ones affected and feel the need to do so, whether it helps or not.
A few others do it to simply avoid the matter.
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RE: Prayers don't work so why do religious keep jabbing at it?
August 9, 2019 at 9:03 am
(This post was last modified: August 9, 2019 at 9:07 am by Anomalocaris.)
(August 9, 2019 at 8:38 am)Bmanne Wrote: I think many people do it because they lack any other means to help the ones affected and feel the need to do so, whether it helps or not.
A few others do it to simply avoid the matter.
I would say those who pray the loudest does not do so simply to avoid the matter.
They can keep quite and avoid the matter.
Instead they pray loudly because they have the means, do not wish to contribute those means, but still wants to claim credit reward for helping.
It is not too harsh to say prayer is often a theft from those who really needs help.
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